The Founding Fathers Read The Koran

koran1For Founding Fathers, John Adams and Thomas Jefferson among them, being properly educated included owning and reading the Koran. Via Boston.com, a glimpse at the little-known long history of the Koran in America:

Reports of Korans in American libraries go back at least to 1683, when an early settler of Germantown, Pa., brought a German version to these shores. Despite its foreign air, Adams’s Koran had a strong New England pedigree. The first Koran published in the United States, it was printed in Springfield in 1806.

Why would John Adams and a cluster of farmers in the Connecticut valley have bought copies of the Koran in 1806? Surprisingly, there was a long tradition of New Englanders reading in the Islamic scripture. No book states the case more plainly than a single volume, tucked away deep within the citadel of Copley Square — the Boston Public Library. The book known as Adams 281.1 is a copy of the Koran, from the personal collection of John Adams.

Thomas Jefferson, especially, had a familiarity with Islam that borders on the astonishing. Like Adams, he owned a Koran, a 1764 English edition that he bought while studying law as a young man in Williamsburg, Va. Only two years ago, that Koran became the center of a controversy, when the first Muslim ever elected to Congress, Keith Ellison, a Democrat from Minnesota, asked if he could place his hand on it while taking his oath of office — a request that elicited tremendous screeches from the talk radio extremists. Jefferson even tried to learn Arabic.

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  • $4251815

    It’s obvious the Founding Fathers were radical Kenyan Muslim anti-colonialists. I think they were also Zionist Fascist Communist Hindu Che Guevara followers. Heard that on an internet radio show.

  • ZombieStomper

    It’s obvious the Founding Fathers were radical Kenyan Muslim anti-colonialists. I think they were also Zionist Fascist Communist Hindu Che Guevara followers. Heard that on an internet radio show.

  • Vox Penii

    >Why would John Adams and a cluster of farmers in the Connecticut valley have bought copies of the Koran in 1806?

    Because people in Colonial America were voracious readers of material that would gag a modern-day graduate student. (See Tocqueville)

  • Andrew

    Well, that explains why they got so much wrong, doesn’t it?

    • Butter Knife

      I believe there’s a better explanation: their humanity. Human beings fuck up frequently, and at times spectacularly.

      Roughly 10 times out of 10, when something goes really, seriously, horrifyingly wrong in the world, and people are literally left shitting themselves and asking “how the…? what? why? FUCKBALLS?!?!?”, the root cause of the problem turns out to be some asshole fucking shit up because they’re too dumb not to do something obviously stupid.

      Go ahead, point out some counter examples. Try it.

      The Constitution was pretty good, and certain parts of it were brilliant, groundbreaking, and downright revolutionary. That doesn’t mean it is or ever was perfect (and we’ve got the 27 amendments to prove it!), and sure as fuck doesn’t mean the guys who sort of collaborated on writing it were perfect… or even particularly good.

  • Andrew

    Well, that explains why they got so much wrong, doesn’t it?

  • A Bad Joke

    Glenn Beck could not be reached for comment, however a single gun shot was heard in his office by staffers.

    • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

      and two weeks later…the smell was still indistinguishable from normal.

  • A Bad Joke

    Glenn Beck could not be reached for comment, however a single gun shot was heard in his office by staffers.

  • DeepCough

    Wait, does this make the “Founding Fathers” terrorists (the Boston Tea Party notwithstanding)?

  • DeepCough

    Wait, does this make the “Founding Fathers” terrorists (the Boston Tea Party notwithstanding)?

  • Pacific_waters

    And your point is?

  • Pacific_waters

    And your point is?

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    and two weeks later…the smell was still indistinguishable from normal.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    Only goes to show that literacy and a basic understanding of the beliefs of others was considered not merely healthy…but an ideal state of being for a gentleperson born after the Enlightenment came underway.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    Only goes to show that literacy and a basic understanding of the beliefs of others was considered not merely healthy…but an ideal state of being for a gentleperson born after the Enlightenment came underway.

  • RanDumbGuy

    Did anybody besides me happen to ask why it was that Jefferson felt the need to own and read a copy of the Koran?

    Jefferson needed that copy of the Koran because he was desperate to learn something about Islam from that religion’s written de facto standard of all things Muslim. Why? Because the United States was going to war in the early 1800s against ultra-conservative, radical Muslims.

    During the early formative years of the United States, our forefathers fought an international group of terrorists who, like today’s conservative, Wahhabi-type, radical Muslims, made no distinction between geopolitical nation states. They were called the Barbary Pirates.

    The Barbary states of North Africa were using the ports of today’s Algeria, Libya, and Tunisia to wage a war of piracy and enslavement against all shipping that passed through the Strait of Gibraltar. Thousands of vessels were taken, and more than a million Europeans and Americans sold into slavery.

    Since Jefferson had no CIA to tell him how these people thought & acted, the Koran was his primary reference source. It was not used to discover enlightening thoughts about a religion of peace, but as a source of intel against our nation’s enemies.

    • Liam_McGonagle

      Hey, not calling you a liar. Maybe just uninformed. Or lazy. See your shoddy cut-and-past job is pretty transparent.

      http://www.khouse.org/articles/2007/691

      But to the point: Your thesis is 100% wrong. Just not possible. Thomas Jefferson was clearly NOT motivated to acquire his copy of the Qu’ran by the need for ‘CIA-type intellegence’ to use against the Barbary pirates. In fact, Jefferson acquired his copy in 1765–about 20 years BEFORE his first encounter with the Barbary state in 1785.

      http://www.cairchicago.org/doc/thomas_jefferson_quran.pdf

      Now Jefferson certainly was a man of perspecuity, but Nostradamus he was not.

      And it may be of interest to note something of the careers of the authors whose work underlies our respective posts.

      William Welty, “Phd.”, whose work you plagiarized (I think that’s what you call word-for-word recapitulation without citation, no?). Interesting home page: “Do everything to the glory of God — 1st Corinthians 10:31b”

      http://www.williamwelty.com

      Lots of interesting things to see at this site. The thing that I found especially rib-tickling was the note that Louisiana Baptist University, whence Mr. Welty claims his “Phd.”, is “. . . not officially accredited by traditional organizations . . . ” http://www.williamwelty.com/about_us.htm

      Pretty stark contrast to the career of the author I cite, Kevin J. Hayes, whose “Ph.D.” comes from the less exotic but actually accredited University of Delaware.

      http://www.libarts.uco.edu/english/faculty/hayes/

      Also Dr. Hayes seems to actually have a trackrecord of scholarship vis-a-vis the history of literature in early America, having published books on the likes of Captain John Smith, Herman Melville and Henry James.

      So it’s hardly surprising that Dr. Hayes emphasis is on the mundane matters of proper citation and actual historical research, whereas Mr. Welty’s is on polemecs and ‘Biblical’ agendas.

      • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

        I think some applause is called for. This was cooler than a public flogging…less bloody and more informative! *claps and shouts for encore*

        • Liam_McGonagle

          You are too kind.

          But really it’s a team effort, these displays. None of it could happen without the enthusiastic work of dedicated f*cktards who selfishly devote hours to copying and pasting worthless drivel composed by rightwing ideologues and self-proclaimed preachermen with dodgy academic credentials.

          It may perhaps also be worthy of note that the poster chose to focus on Thomas Jefferson (albeit in a totally in accurate and misleading manner) rather than John Adams.

          It may just be possible to sustain a xenophobic interpretation of Adams’ Qu’ran ownership. I am unable to find much information about precisely when Adams acquired his copy or specific indications as to the use to which he may have put it. But certainly Adams made some aggressively disparaging comments about Islam in the context of the Barbary war.

          But Adams made disparaging comments about EVERYONE. Do a little research and it won’t take you long to find out that this guy had it in for just about everyone who ever had to work with him. His long-standing feud with the Democrat-Republican Jefferson is no secret. But he also publicly nourished bitter resentments against supporters of his own Federalist party like Hamilton and (scandal!) George Washington.

          Adams had a bit of the conspiracy nut in him. He was convinced that Franklin and the Comte de Vergennes, busy in Paris negotiating the deals that would finance U.S. independence, were hatching evil plots to destroy him. In fact, Adams had the nuts to write a formal letter to Congress to that effect! Franklin’s response? A never-released private letter summarizing his own opinion of Adams.

          “He means well for his country, is always and honest man, often a wise one, but sometimes, and in some things, is absolutely out of his senses.”

          And of course, Adams’ actual term as President doesn’t have much to recommend it either. Two particular examples seem interesting to me, though.

          1. The Alien Sedition Act, a series of xenophobic legislation regarded by most historians with degrees from CREDENTIALED schools as a thinly disguised ploy by Adams’ Federalist party to disenfranchise the supporters of the rival Democratic-Republican party. Although the act expired without direct challenge in court, references to the act in subsequent decisions make clear that it is regarded as fundamentally un-constitutional.

          2. The Fries Rebellion. Adams’ government imposed an unprecedented and incredibly unpopular property tax in 1798. So unpopular, in fact, that farmers in Pennsylvania rose in rebellion. Adams’ mis-handling of the matter is widely regarded as a par excellence example of clumsy executive f*cknardery.

          Yeah, Adams has never been America’s favourite Founding Father. And there’s no way he’d ever become the poster child for the Tea Bagger movement either. He was the archetecht of the bicameral legislature, designed specifically as a counter-weight to the excesses of the ‘ignorant masses’. He never hid his contempt for the ‘ordinary man’.

          • Adam

            c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-ombo breaker!!!

          • GoodDoktorBad

            Excellent…….Thanks Liam!

      • wheredotheygetthiscrap?

        Wow, spent a few minutes putting together a rebuttal to that tripe RanDumbGuy was espousing, then discovered you’d already done so. Good show.
        I’d like to add really quick that the Barbary Pirates were drawn from several north african groups, Moors, Berbers, etc, who all identified as Sunnis, not Wahhabis. Wahhabism had barely been in existence for a few decades and had yet to leave the Arabian Peninsula at the time of the Barbary Pirates

        • Liam_McGonagle

          Yes, good points. I haven’t really taken the time to do so yet, but I think it may be rewarding to understand just why the “Islam Commentaries” project Welty oversaw to ‘combat Wahabism’ folded in 2008. With any luck it just might turn up some juicy internecine warfare within the ‘christian’ right, a la Frank Gaffney vs. Grover Norquist. It’s fun to watch right-wingers implode from the tensions of their own hatred and incompetence.

          http://islamcommentaries.com

    • Maui

      I heard once upon a time that, the Qu’ran is the last book to be explored by the high ranked masons (32 & 33 degree) and most of the founding fathers where masons. maybe this deservers more explorations, no?

  • RanDumbGuy

    Did anybody besides me happen to ask why it was that Jefferson felt the need to own and read a copy of the Koran?

    Jefferson needed that copy of the Koran because he was desperate to learn something about Islam from that religion’s written de facto standard of all things Muslim. Why? Because the United States was going to war in the early 1800s against ultra-conservative, radical Muslims.

    During the early formative years of the United States, our forefathers fought an international group of terrorists who, like today’s conservative, Wahhabi-type, radical Muslims, made no distinction between geopolitical nation states. They were called the Barbary Pirates.

    The Barbary states of North Africa were using the ports of today’s Algeria, Libya, and Tunisia to wage a war of piracy and enslavement against all shipping that passed through the Strait of Gibraltar. Thousands of vessels were taken, and more than a million Europeans and Americans sold into slavery.

    Since Jefferson had no CIA to tell him how these people thought & acted, the Koran was his primary reference source. It was not used to discover enlightening thoughts about a religion of peace, but as a source of intel against our nation’s enemies.

  • guest51

    The reason they read the koran was because they didn’t have Fox News to tell them not too. Thank Fox God for today Fox God will tell you what to think and the first law of Fox God is:

    Think not for yourself. Read not, but rather tune into Fox God to get your daily words to parrot and no one parrots like you then point at that person and shrill loud, Fox God will take care of it.

  • guest51

    The reason they read the koran was because they didn’t have Fox News to tell them not too. Thank Fox God for today Fox God will tell you what to think and the first law of Fox God is:

    Think not for yourself. Read not, but rather tune into Fox God to get your daily words to parrot and no one parrots like you then point at that person and shrill loud, Fox God will take care of it.

  • Anonymous

    Hey, not calling you a liar. Maybe just uninformed. Or lazy. See your shoddy cut-and-past job is pretty transparent.

    http://www.khouse.org/articles/2007/691

    But to the point: Your thesis is 100% wrong. Just not possible. Thomas Jefferson was clearly NOT motivated to acquire his copy of the Qu’ran by the need for ‘CIA-type intellegence’ to use against the Barbary pirates. In fact, Jefferson acquired his copy in 1765–about 20 years BEFORE his first encounter with the Barbary state in 1785.

    http://www.cairchicago.org/doc/thomas_jefferson_quran.pdf

    Now Jefferson certainly was a man of perspecuity, but Nostradamus he was not.

    And it may be of interest to note something of the careers of the authors whose work underlies our respective posts.

    William Welty, “Phd.”, whose work you plagiarized (I think that’s what you call word-for-word recapitulation without citation, no?). Interesting home page: “Do everything to the glory of God — 1st Corinthians 10:31b”

    http://www.williamwelty.com

    Lots of interesting things to see at this site. The thing that I found especially rib-tickling was the note that Louisiana Baptist University, whence Mr. Welty claims his “Phd.”, is “. . . not officially accredited by traditional organizations . . . ” http://www.williamwelty.com/about_us.htm

    Pretty stark contrast to the career of the author I cite, Kevin J. Hayes, whose “Ph.D.” comes from the less exotic but actually accredited University of Delaware.

    http://www.libarts.uco.edu/english/faculty/hayes/

    Also Dr. Hayes seems to actually have a trackrecord of scholarship vis-a-vis the history of literature in early America, having published books on the likes of Captain John Smith, Herman Melville and Henry James.

    So it’s hardly surprising that Dr. Hayes emphasis is on the mundane matters of proper citation and actual historical research, whereas Mr. Welty’s is on polemecs and ‘Biblical’ agendas.

  • Donakelly

    http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?/topic/41301-why-did-president-jefferson-read-the-quran/

    http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=39616

    so is it myth or fact? a little of both? I just linked a couple of passages I found..don’t want to be accused of any plagarism here.

    • eyebeam

      Ah so you believe Jefferson was a seer with the ability to see the future? He acquired his Koran 20 years before encountering the Barbary States, and 35 years before his Presidency, so he’d have plenty of time to read it… Yeah, makes a lot of sense. Citing mega-retardo WND will not help you here.

  • Donakelly

    http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?/topic/41301-why-did-president-jefferson-read-the-quran/

    http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=39616

    so is it myth or fact? a little of both? I just linked a couple of passages I found..don’t want to be accused of any plagarism here.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    I think some applause is called for. This was cooler than a public flogging…less bloody and more informative! *claps and shouts for encore*

  • Anonymous

    You are too kind.

    But really it’s a team effort, these displays. None of it could happen without the enthusiastic work of dedicated f*cktards who selfishly devote hours to copying and pasting worthless drivel composed by rightwing ideologues and self-proclaimed preachermen with dodgy academic credentials.

    It may perhaps also be worthy of note that the poster chose to focus on Thomas Jefferson (albeit in a totally in accurate and misleading manner) rather than John Adams.

    It may just be possible to sustain a xenophobic interpretation of Adams’ Qu’ran ownership. I am unable to find much information about precisely when Adams acquired his copy or specific indications as to the use to which he may have put it. But certainly Adams made some aggressively disparaging comments about Islam in the context of the Barbary war.

    But Adams made disparaging comments about EVERYONE. Do a little research and it won’t take you long to find out that this guy had it in for just about everyone who ever had to work with him. His long-standing feud with the Democrat-Republican Jefferson is no secret. But he also publicly nourished bitter resentments against supporters of his own Federalist party like Hamilton and (scandal!) George Washington.

    Adams had a bit of the conspiracy nut in him. He was convinced that Franklin and the Comte de Vergennes, busy in Paris negotiating the deals that would finance U.S. independence, were hatching evil plots to destroy him. In fact, Adams had the nuts to write a formal letter to Congress to that effect! Franklin’s response? A never-released private letter summarizing his own opinion of Adams.

    “He means well for his country, is always and honest man, often a wise one, but sometimes, and in some things, is absolutely out of his senses.”

    And of course, Adams’ actual term as President doesn’t have much to recommend it either. Two particular examples seem interesting to me, though.

    1. The Alien Sedition Act, a series of xenophobic legislation regarded by most historians with degrees from CREDENTIALED schools as a thinly disguised ploy by Adams’ Federalist party to disenfranchise the supporters of the rival Democratic-Republican party. Although the act expired without direct challenge in court, references to the act in subsequent decisions make clear that it is regarded as fundamentally un-constitutional.

    2. The Fries Rebellion. Adams’ government imposed an unprecedented and incredibly unpopular property tax in 1798. So unpopular, in fact, that farmers in Pennsylvania rose in rebellion. Adams’ mis-handling of the matter is widely regarded as a par excellence example of clumsy executive f*cknardery.

    Yeah, Adams has never been America’s favourite Founding Father. And there’s no way he’d ever become the poster child for the Tea Bagger movement either. He was the archetecht of the bicameral legislature, designed specifically as a counter-weight to the excesses of the ‘ignorant masses’. He never hid his contempt for the ‘ordinary man’.

  • http://twitter.com/eyebeam Chris

    Ah so you believe Jefferson was a seer with the ability to see the future? He acquired his Koran 20 years before encountering the Barbary States, and 35 years before his Presidency, so he’d have plenty of time to read it… Yeah, makes a lot of sense. Citing mega-retardo WND will not help you here.

  • biblthmp

    Jeffereson was studying to know his enemies. He was at war with the Muslim who were the Barbary Pirates. There was no CIA to do the research, so he had to do it on his own. Remember the line in the Marines’ Hymn, about the “Shores of Tripoli”, that was part of Libya, where Jefferson was fighting the Muslim Barbary Pirates.

  • biblthmp

    Jeffereson was studying to know his enemies. He was at war with the Muslim who were the Barbary Pirates. There was no CIA to do the research, so he had to do it on his own. Remember the line in the Marines’ Hymn, about the “Shores of Tripoli”, that was part of Libya, where Jefferson was fighting the Muslim Barbary Pirates.

  • Adam

    c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-ombo breaker!!!

  • Butter Knife

    I believe there’s a better explanation: their humanity. Human beings fuck up frequently, and at times spectacularly.

    Roughly 10 times out of 10, when something goes really, seriously, horrifyingly wrong in the world, and people are literally left shitting themselves and asking “how the…? what? why? FUCKBALLS?!?!?”, the root cause of the problem turns out to be some asshole fucking shit up because they’re too dumb not to do something obviously stupid.

    Go ahead, point out some counter examples. Try it.

    The Constitution was pretty good, and certain parts of it were brilliant, groundbreaking, and downright revolutionary. That doesn’t mean it is or ever was perfect (and we’ve got the 27 amendments to prove it!), and sure as fuck doesn’t mean the guys who sort of collaborated on writing it were perfect… or even particularly good.

  • Chuxcuz

    Incredible ignorance on your part, JacobSloan. See http://politisite.com/2010/09/10/john-adams-franklin-and-others-founders-read-the-quran/ to learn what our founders believed about Islam and the Q’uran. Of course, if you had read the Q’uran yourself, you would not posted this rubbish.

    • Liam_McGonagle

      Um, don’t know how you’re gonna take this, chief, but YOU DONE BEEN PLAYED!

      Whoever sent that link to you must not think very much of you. Next time you see him, check to see whether he’s laughing behind his hand at you.

      See, the FULL text of that March 23, 1790 letter of Benjamin Franklin from your friend’s link selectively quotes gives rather a different meaning . . .

      http://founders-blog.blogspot.com/2010/03/benjamin-franklin-to-federal-gazette.html

      In fact your friend could not have chosen more poorly, for this is one of Franklin’s most scathing satires against CHRISTIAN hypocrisy attempting to justify slavery in the American South: the so-called “Sidi Mehmet Ibrahim” letter.

      Published as an open letter to the Federal Gazette, it is Franklin’s parody of a speech by the white Georgia congressman James Jackson, who (mis)-used the Christian Bible in order to justify slavery.

      The bit quoted in your friend’s link was dialogue put by Franklin into the mouth of the obviously FICTIONAL character Sidi Mehmet Ibrahim in order to make hysterically clear the fact that racist goons like Jackson have in fact much more in common with the ‘infidels’ than they think. Hence one key bit from the letter you DIDN’T quote:

      ” . . . men’s interests and intellects operate and are operated on with surprising similarity in all countries and climates, whenever they are under similar circumstances. . . . .”

      So basically your friend twisted Franklin’s meaning 180 degrees OPPOSITE from Franklin’s clearly noble true intention.

      Don’t feel too bad, though. “Teachable Moment” for you there, free of charge. And one last piece of advice: ACTUALLY DO A LITTLE RESEARCH BEFORE YOU GO SPREADING BLATHER ABOUT. It Will eventually result in much less humiliation for you.

      • veleniki

        Thank you. I really enjoyed your informative answers that made the fucktards run away, unable to counter intelligence & research with parroting.

  • Chuxcuz

    Incredible ignorance on your part, JacobSloan. See http://politisite.com/2010/09/10/john-adams-franklin-and-others-founders-read-the-quran/ to learn what our founders believed about Islam and the Q’uran. Of course, if you had read the Q’uran yourself, you would not posted this rubbish.

  • Miles Tougeaux

    Maybe they read it because they found out it was even more hilarious and absurd than the Bible (albeit a bit slow through the middle)

  • Miles Tougeaux

    Maybe they read it because they found out it was even more hilarious and absurd than the Bible (albeit a bit slow through the middle)

  • Anonymous

    Um, don’t know how you’re gonna take this, chief, but YOU DONE BEEN PLAYED!

    Whoever sent that link to you must not think very much of you. Next time you see him, check to see whether he’s laughing behind his hand at you.

    See, the FULL text of that March 23, 1790 letter of Benjamin Franklin from your friend’s link selectively quotes gives rather a different meaning . . .

    http://founders-blog.blogspot.com/2010/03/benjamin-franklin-to-federal-gazette.html

    In fact your friend could not have chosen more poorly, for this is one of Franklin’s most scathing satires against CHRISTIAN hypocrisy attempting to justify slavery in the American South: the so-called “Sidi Mehmet Ibrahim” letter.

    Published as an open letter to the Federal Gazette, it is Franklin’s parody of a speech by the white Georgia congressman James Jackson, who (mis)-used the Christian Bible in order to justify slavery.

    The bit quoted in your friend’s link was dialogue put by Franklin into the mouth of the obviously FICTIONAL character Sidi Mehmet Ibrahim in order to make hysterically clear the fact that racist goons like Jackson have in fact much more in common with the ‘infidels’ than they think. Hence one key bit from the letter you DIDN’T quote:

    ” . . . men’s interests and intellects operate and are operated on with surprising similarity in all countries and climates, whenever they are under similar circumstances. . . . .”

    So basically your friend twisted Franklin’s meaning 180 degrees OPPOSITE from Franklin’s clearly noble true intention.

    Don’t feel too bad, though. “Teachable Moment” for you there, free of charge. And one last piece of advice: ACTUALLY DO A LITTLE RESEARCH BEFORE YOU GO SPREADING BLATHER ABOUT. It Will eventually result in much less humiliation for you.

  • Polostar

    Okay, so Adams and Jefferson owned copies of the Koran. I own many religious books that I reference in research, such as an original Book of Mormon, but don’t follow or believe in its teachings. One only has to read the writings of these two founders to know that they held Christian beliefs.

    • Barneymac17

      Jefferson may have been raised in the christian faith, but he was clearly a deist.

  • Polostar

    Okay, so Adams and Jefferson owned copies of the Koran. I own many religious books that I reference in research, such as an original Book of Mormon, but don’t follow or believe in its teachings. One only has to read the writings of these two founders to know that they held Christian beliefs.

  • Barneymac17

    Jefferson may have been raised in the christian faith, but he was clearly a deist.

  • Anonymous

    Excellent…….Thanks Liam!

  • wheredotheygetthiscrap?

    Wow, spent a few minutes putting together a rebuttal to that tripe RanDumbGuy was espousing, then discovered you’d already done so. Good show.
    I’d like to add really quick that the Barbary Pirates were drawn from several north african groups, Moors, Berbers, etc, who all identified as Sunnis, not Wahhabis. Wahhabism had barely been in existence for a few decades and had yet to leave the Arabian Peninsula at the time of the Barbary Pirates

  • Anonymous

    Yes, good points. I haven’t really taken the time to do so yet, but I think it may be rewarding to understand just why the “Islam Commentaries” project Welty oversaw to ‘combat Wahabism’ folded in 2008. With any luck it just might turn up some juicy internecine warfare within the ‘christian’ right, a la Frank Gaffney vs. Grover Norquist. It’s fun to watch right-wingers implode from the tensions of their own hatred and incompetence.

    http://islamcommentaries.com

  • el8ed1

    Thank you. I really enjoyed your informative answers that made the fucktards run away, unable to counter intelligence & research with parroting.

  • Maui

    I heard once upon a time that, the Qu’ran is the last book to be explored by the high ranked masons (32 & 33 degree) and most of the founding fathers where masons. maybe this deservers more explorations, no?

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