Coming Soon: A New American Civil War?

US-FederalReserveSystem-SealIt’s a crazy thought, but Stephen Gandel at TIME suggests that “The Creature From Jekyll Island,” better known to most Americans as our privatized central bank, the “Federal” (ain’t nothing federal about it) Reserve, could trigger a new civil war:

What is the most likely cause today of civil unrest? Immigration. Gay Marriage. Abortion. The Results of Election Day. The Mosque at Ground Zero. Nope.

Try the Federal Reserve. November 3rd is when the Federal Reserve’s next policy committee meeting ends, and if you thought this was just another boring money meeting you would be wrong. It could be the most important meeting in Fed history, maybe. The US central bank is expected to announce its next move to boost the faltering economic recovery. To say there has been considerable debate and anxiety among Fed watchers about what the central bank should do would be an understatement. Chairman Ben Bernanke has indicated in recent speeches that the central bank plans to try to drive down already low-interest rates by buying up long-term bonds. A number of people both inside the Fed and out believe this is the wrong move. But one website seems to believe that Ben’s plan might actually lead to armed conflict. Last week, the blog, Zerohedge wrote, paraphrasing a top economic forecaster David Rosenberg, that it believed the Fed’s plan is not only moronic, but “positions US society one step closer to civil war if not worse.” (See photos inside the world of Ben Bernanke)

I’m not sure what “if not worse,” is supposed to mean. But, with the Tea Party gaining followers, the idea of civil war over economic issues doesn’t seem that far-fetched these days. And Ron Paul definitely thinks the Fed should be ended. In TIME’s recently cover story on the militia movement many said these groups are powder kegs looking for a catalyst. So why not a Fed policy committee meeting…

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  • GoodDoktorBad

    It amazes me how few people actually know that the “Federal” reserve is a PRIVATE institution. It is a private entity that serves this country like a leach cures blood loss.

    There will be no “freedom” until it burns…

  • Anonymous

    It amazes me how few people actually know that the “Federal” reserve is a PRIVATE institution. It is a private entity that serves this country like a leach cures blood loss.

    There will be no “freedom” until it burns…

  • Ironaddict06

    Few people realize the Federal Reserve is a private instution. Originally money was supplied through the U.S. treasurey. The Federal Reserve was created in 1913.
    Here is a good link that will explain how the Federal Reserve was created and why.
    http://news.goldseek.com/GoldSeek/1095269452.php
    People that live in small communities could take back control of their money if they traded their
    goods&services for precious metals(gold,silver,copper,etc). How long the gov’t would allow this to happen?

  • Ironaddict06

    Few people realize the Federal Reserve is a private instution. Originally money was supplied through the U.S. treasurey. The Federal Reserve was created in 1913.
    Here is a good link that will explain how the Federal Reserve was created and why.
    http://news.goldseek.com/GoldSeek/1095269452.php
    People that live in small communities could take back control of their money if they traded their
    goods&services for precious metals(gold,silver,copper,etc). How long the gov’t would allow this to happen?

  • Br0wnB3rry

    and while the US is busy fighting over things at home that is when 5 of it’s major citys get taken out along with EU and the middle east

    • GoodDoktorBad

      Please explain…….

      • Hadrian999

        i think he misses 24

  • Br0wnB3rry

    and while the US is busy fighting over things at home that is when 5 of it’s major citys get taken out along with EU and the middle east

  • Anonymous

    Please explain…….

  • Liam_McGonagle

    Actually, when I heard the Fed was thinking about buying up bonds, I was mildly encouraged.

    Not because I believe it would be the most excellent super-effective policy, or that it would raise portfolio allocation questions for individuals. But because it seems to be an attempt in the right direction—sucking some of the air out of the bloated M3 measure of money supply.

    I think Zerohedge may need to sit down and re-think their position on this. Clearly the problem is NOT “too much liquidity in the market”–the problem is that all that liquidity is residing in too few hands, besides being grossly inflated in market “value”. How healthy and “liquid” can a money supply be where nearly $0.40 of every dollar is comprised of M3 funny money and where 85% of financial wealth is in the hands of the richest 20%?

    True, this bond buy-back program is among the least efficient methods of acheiving that end. First, it takes some M3 securities out of the system and replaces them with debased M1. Also, one possible scenario is that the resulting scarcity of federal bonds and presumably higher yields for remaining investors could result in more reallocation to less worthy private sector vehicles rather than lending to small regional banks and businesses–the ones that do the real job generation. And if those yields do go up, that may go some way to raising the value of the dollar relative to other currencies, exacerbating the trade deficit.

    But I think it shows a positive sign that Bernanke recognizes that the problem is M3. So, despite or maybe because of the outrage of dumbfucks like Rand Paul preparing to declare Civl War II “The Re-Doomening” over this tepid half-measure, I feel that the emergence of REAL solutions on the horizon–like tax increases on corps and the wealthy securities holders–will probably be hitting the public’s radar. Say in six months or so. I hope.

    • myth_slayer

      No offense, but while you make one or two good points later on, you are seriously drinking the Kool-Aid when you state:

      “Actually, when I heard the Fed was thinking about buying up bonds, I was mildly encouraged.”

      The are in actuality pouring in liquidity into an already created cesspool, economically speaking. While you are highly accurate to state that liquidity resides in too few hands, this does not spread it around but continues to pour it into those few hands.

      No insult or annoyance intended, but you may find you are a bit confused on the details, no doubt from reading that most concentrated source of confusion and bewilderment, the American non-media.

      When those federal stimulus funds are directed towards the transportation industry, they don’t directly fund the American transportation industry but DO directly fund foreign transportation industries with the purchase of railroad and such vehicles from overseas.

      Extrapolate from there and the macro picture becomes clearer. The main problem with thinking from a decidedly monetary POV is that monetary philosophy ignores debt, and that is the principal power wielded by these people!

      Bernanke is either the complete lackey stooge or he really doesn’t understand the causes leading up to the Great Depression, and those similarities today.

      Hint: illegal and unregulated funds (dark pools), securitization, Samuel Straus in 1909, Prohibition and the removal of liquor and beer taxation, and the laundering of funds through the exchanges, and the continuation by the banksters, and their lackey pols, of securitized credit derivatives today.

      While further stimulus is needed, when it goes into an economy which has been dismantled over the preceding 35 years, it ends up mostly going into the hands of the concentrated super-rich, and to overseas locations.

      • Liam_McGonagle

        No offense, but read what I wrote in its entirety and carefully. Go to a dictionary for definition of key terms when you need to. Here’s a crib sheet to help you out:

        1. Clearly there is NOT an over-liquidity problem in the market; funds are locked up in the accounts of the uber-wealthy, big banks and corps and NOT getting down to the mid- and small- size businesses that are responsible for 2/3 of all net job creation. That is clearly why the Dow is over 11,000 again and unemployment still shows no signs of budging.

        2. M3 includes debt as well as equity instruments which comprise the porfolios of the various money market funds as well as stand-alone instruments. http://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/m3.asp You should understand that before you go around accusing people of ignoring debt.

        3. I already touched upon the trade deficit situation, so your note really doesn’t add any additional value except to agree with what I’d already written. Read again. Only this time carefully.

        4. You seem strangely to feel that a money supply that is 40% bullshit M3 securities churned out by the under-regulated financial markets is not a significant problem. Think again about that. Next time you go to the grocery store, perform this little mental experiment: Take your total bill and add an additional 2/3. If the money supply were suddenly and over-night to right-size, that is how much you would be paying for those same items next week. That IS a problem, friend.

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Components_of_the_United_States_money_supply2.svg

        5. Finally, the point is that the Fed is slowly beginning to realize the liquidity problem is in M3. Not that this policy is the solution, or that dumbass critics like Paul are correct in their criticisms. Read what I’ve written again but carefully. And go to a dictionary for any terms you don’t understand.

        I totally ignored that incoherent hash about liquor and beer taxation and Samuel Strauss.

        Listen, I understand your frustration with the slow pace of events, but given the current political environment, even the slightest movement in the correct direction from Ben “Slower Learner” Bernanke is clearly much better than the light-speed moves backwards that douchebags like Richard Rahn would have made.

        It’s up to the wider culture to start talking about real, direct means of right-sizing this, like taxing the uber-wealthy to simultaneously:
        1. Deflate M3
        2. Deconstruct the Big Banks
        3. Get liquidity back into the real economy

        Conspiracy theories like “Ben is a Stooge for a Shadowy Conspiracy of World Bankers” don’t help. They punish him for his first steps in the right direction and undermine the credibility of conspiracy proponents. People pushing that kind of talk clearly have never worked in an organization of over 5 people, because phantasies of the type of seamless cooperation they imagine would instantly dissolve upon contact with reality.

    • GoodDoktorBad

      “But I think it shows a positive sign that Bernanke recognizes that the problem is M3.”

      I’m sorry Liam, but finding anything positive about Bernacke and the rest of the Fed scum is frankly ludicrous. They should all be convicted of treason and crimes against humanity, hung by the neck until dead and their assets redistributed. Their families can all be put on welfare and live in a housing project -let them have food stamps and public education. “Let them eat cake” indeed.
      I just think you’re spraying perfume on a pile of shit when we should just hit the flush lever.

      Nothing personal man….

      • Liam_McGonagle

        I appreciate your anger, but I think the analysis you present above may not adequately address two salient facts here:

        1. Bernanke is a symptom, not a primary cause. Fed policy, which has historically and long before Bernanke been Big Bank friendly, is driven by “conventional wisdom” rather than common sense. That is what large organizations demand–until driven into a corner by rare or unprecedented long-term emergencies like this one, that is.

        His mistakes–and I think my comments make clear that I consider him a “slow learner”–have not been small. But they’re NOT the mistakes of a personally devious agent of Satan, such as Grover Norquist may possibly be, given his publicly declared intention to destroy the United States.

        No, Bernanke’s mistakes are those of an overly conventional Kool Aid drinker. My comment merely raised the point that this latest policy action indicates that Bernanke may be on the cusp of an epiphany, an epiphany whose sincerity and import you and I should not discount just because we may have experienced several years ago.

        I don’t think it helps anyone to condemn progress, no matter how partial or late in coming, do you?

        2. When did either myself or Bernanke say “Let them eat cake”? Never. I think that may just be your anger getting away from you there.

  • Liam_McGonagle

    Actually, when I heard the Fed was thinking about buying up bonds, I was mildly encouraged.

    Not because I believe it would be the most excellent super-effective policy, or that it would raise portfolio allocation questions for individuals. But because it seems to be an attempt in the right direction—sucking some of the air out of the bloated M3 measure of money supply.

    I think Zerohedge may need to sit down and re-think their position on this. Clearly the problem is NOT “too much liquidity in the market”–the problem is that all that liquidity is residing in too few hands, besides being grossly inflated in market “value”. How healthy and “liquid” can a money supply be where nearly $0.40 of every dollar is comprised of M3 funny money and where 85% of financial wealth is in the hands of the richest 20%?

    True, this bond buy-back program is among the least efficient methods of acheiving that end. First, it takes some M3 securities out of the system and replaces them with debased M1. Also, one possible scenario is that the resulting scarcity of federal bonds and presumably higher yields for remaining investors could result in more reallocation to less worthy private sector vehicles rather than lending to small regional banks and businesses–the ones that do the real job generation. And if those yields do go up, that may go some way to raising the value of the dollar relative to other currencies, exacerbating the trade deficit.

    But I think it shows a positive sign that Bernanke recognizes that the problem is M3. So, despite or maybe because of the outrage of dumbfucks like Rand Paul preparing to declare Civl War II “The Re-Doomening” over this tepid half-measure, I feel that the emergence of REAL solutions on the horizon–like tax increases on corps and the wealthy securities holders–will probably be hitting the public’s radar. Say in six months or so. I hope.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    If a civil war is ignited in this country…it may yet be over immigration, health care or gay rights. The religious culture war has FAR more emotional sway over people and more power to move people to action than the tiny fringe of goldbugs who gripe about the Fed daily. Portions of the South and West are so virulently right wing in the culture war, so drenched in Christian xenophobia, that they consider all who don’t share their fringe radical views to be un-American…and even anti-American.

    If it comes to civil war…I’m sure there will be militant weenies in the background bleating about the evils of big government and the Fed…but they will be an effete minority of intellectuals in a vast sea of marching booted xenophobic, homophobic drones.

    • Dan

      I tried to follow your post, but somehow got lost in the fields of name-calling.

      • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

        It was a very short post…try harder.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    If a civil war is ignited in this country…it may yet be over immigration, health care or gay rights. The religious culture war has FAR more emotional sway over people and more power to move people to action than the tiny fringe of goldbugs who gripe about the Fed daily. Portions of the South and West are so virulently right wing in the culture war, so drenched in Christian xenophobia, that they consider all who don’t share their fringe radical views to be un-American…and even anti-American.

    If it comes to civil war…I’m sure there will be militant weenies in the background bleating about the evils of big government and the Fed…but they will be an effete minority of intellectuals in a vast sea of marching booted xenophobic, homophobic drones.

  • Anonymous

    No offense, but while you make one or two good points later on, you are seriously drinking the Kool-Aid when you state:

    “Actually, when I heard the Fed was thinking about buying up bonds, I was mildly encouraged.”

    The are in actuality pouring in liquidity into an already created cesspool, economically speaking. While you are highly accurate to state that liquidity resides in too few hands, this does not spread it around but continues to pour it into those few hands.

    No insult or annoyance intended, but you may find you are a bit confused on the details, no doubt from reading that most concentrated source of confusion and bewilderment, the American non-media.

    When those federal stimulus funds are directed towards the transportation industry, they don’t directly fund the American transportation industry but DO directly fund foreign transportation industries with the purchase of railroad and such vehicles from overseas.

    Extrapolate from there and the macro picture becomes clearer. The main problem with thinking from a decidedly monetary POV is that monetary philosophy ignores debt, and that is the principal power wielded by these people!

    Bernanke is either the complete lackey stooge or he really doesn’t understand the causes leading up to the Great Depression, and those similarities today.

    Hint: illegal and unregulated funds (dark pools), securitization, Samuel Straus in 1909, Prohibition and the removal of liquor and beer taxation, and the laundering of funds through the exchanges, and the continuation by the banksters, and their lackey pols, of securitized credit derivatives today.

    While further stimulus is needed, when it goes into an economy which has been dismantled over the preceding 35 years, it ends up mostly going into the hands of the concentrated super-rich, and to overseas locations.

  • Liam_McGonagle

    No offense, but read what I wrote in its entirety and carefully. Go to a dictionary for definition of key terms when you need to. Here’s a crib sheet to help you out:

    1. Clearly there is NOT an over-liquidity problem in the market; funds are locked up in the accounts of the uber-wealthy, big banks and corps and NOT getting down to the mid- and small- size businesses that are responsible for 2/3 of all net job creation. That is clearly why the Dow is over 11,000 again and unemployment still shows no signs of budging.

    2. M3 includes debt as well as equity instruments which comprise the porfolios of the various money market funds as well as stand-alone instruments. http://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/m3.asp You should understand that before you go around accusing people of ignoring debt.

    3. I already touched upon the trade deficit situation, so your note really doesn’t add any additional value except to agree with what I’d already written. Read again. Only this time carefully.

    4. You seem strangely to feel that a money supply that is 40% bullshit M3 securities churned out by the under-regulated financial markets is not a significant problem. Think again about that. Next time you go to the grocery store, perform this little mental experiment: Take your total bill and add an additional 2/3. If the money supply were suddenly and over-night to right-size, that is how much you would be paying for those same items next week. That IS a problem, friend.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Components_of_the_United_States_money_supply2.svg

    5. Finally, the point is that the Fed is slowly beginning to realize the liquidity problem is in M3. Not that this policy is the solution, or that dumbass critics like Paul are correct in their criticisms. Read what I’ve written again but carefully. And go to a dictionary for any terms you don’t understand.

    I totally ignored that incoherent hash about liquor and beer taxation and Samuel Strauss.

    Listen, I understand your frustration with the slow pace of events, but given the current political environment, even the slightest movement in the correct direction from Ben “Slower Learner” Bernanke is clearly much better than the light-speed moves backwards that douchebags like Richard Rahn would have made.

    It’s up to the wider culture to start talking about real, direct means of right-sizing this, like taxing the uber-wealthy to simultaneously:
    1. Deflate M3
    2. Deconstruct the Big Banks
    3. Get liquidity back into the real economy

    Conspiracy theories like “Ben is a Stooge for a Shadowy Conspiracy of World Bankers” don’t help. They punish him for his first steps in the right direction and undermine the credibility of conspiracy proponents. People pushing that kind of talk clearly have never worked in an organization of over 5 people, because phantasies of the type of seamless cooperation they imagine would instantly dissolve upon contact with reality.

  • Butter Knife

    Personally, and this is just my vote, let’s skip the fighting part and go right to the peace treaty between the United States of Canada and Jesusland. I don’t really want the South around if they’re sick of being in the Union anyway, and certainly not enough to fight over it with them. Let’s just treat this like a bad marriage and dissolve the damned thing before it gets worse.

  • Butter Knife

    Personally, and this is just my vote, let’s skip the fighting part and go right to the peace treaty between the United States of Canada and Jesusland. I don’t really want the South around if they’re sick of being in the Union anyway, and certainly not enough to fight over it with them. Let’s just treat this like a bad marriage and dissolve the damned thing before it gets worse.

  • Hadrian999

    i think he misses 24

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_NWC4YOAVGK7JQHS5UM7ZHW5FZM Nathan Willard

    I wonder if John Titor is reading this?

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_NWC4YOAVGK7JQHS5UM7ZHW5FZM Nathan Willard

    I wonder if John Titor is reading this?

  • Hypnos1

    The question is: Why is Time magazine echoing the civil war meme?

  • Hypnos1

    The question is: Why is Time magazine echoing the civil war meme?

  • Dan

    I tried to follow your post, but somehow got lost in the fields of name-calling.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    It was a very short post…try harder.

  • Anonymous

    “But I think it shows a positive sign that Bernanke recognizes that the problem is M3.”

    I’m sorry Liam, but finding anything positive about Bernacke and the rest of the Fed scum is frankly ludicrous. They should all be convicted of treason and crimes against humanity, hung by the neck until dead and their assets redistributed. Their families can all be put on welfare and live in a housing project -let them have food stamps and public education. “Let them eat cake” indeed.
    I just think you’re spraying perfume on a pile of shit when we should just hit the flush lever.

    Nothing personal man….

  • Anonymous

    I appreciate your anger, but I think the analysis you present above may not adequately address two salient facts here:

    1. Bernanke is a symptom, not a primary cause. Fed policy, which has historically and long before Bernanke been Big Bank friendly, is driven by “conventional wisdom” rather than common sense. That is what large organizations demand–until driven into a corner by rare or unprecedented long-term emergencies like this one, that is.

    His mistakes–and I think my comments make clear that I consider him a “slow learner”–have not been small. But they’re NOT the mistakes of a personally devious agent of Satan, such as Grover Norquist may possibly be, given his publicly declared intention to destroy the United States.

    No, Bernanke’s mistakes are those of an overly conventional Kool Aid drinker. My comment merely raised the point that this latest policy action indicates that Bernanke may be on the cusp of an epiphany, an epiphany whose sincerity and import you and I should not discount just because we may have experienced several years ago.

    I don’t think it helps anyone to condemn progress, no matter how partial or late in coming, do you?

    2. When did either myself or Bernanke say “Let them eat cake”? Never. I think that may just be your anger getting away from you there.

  • Gofuckyourself

    People would have to understand the Federal Reserve system first, which 90% of the dumbfucks in our country don’t…so I wouldn’t count on it.

  • Gofuckyourself

    People would have to understand the Federal Reserve system first, which 90% of the dumbfucks in our country don’t…so I wouldn’t count on it.

  • Wonluckyman

    American libs or commies love to talk, remember that a dead American lib talks no more. It is almost time to kill them! And i could not be happier!!! The streets and homes of the rich or liberals call them what you like will be stained with the blood of the liberals so that freedom can ring for those who love thier freedom, if you dissagree, wait another 60 days or so. We killed millions of them in ww1 and ww2. Up until now freedom was for all! thankfully that is about to change, and thankfully libs cant shoot straight  lol lol hahaha. time to spread THIER wealth.

    • Andrew

      Thanks for the evidence!  I’m sure the FBI will find your Disqus trail very useful should you ever go beyond commenting on the Internet.

  • Wonluckyman

    American libs or commies love to talk, remember that a dead American lib talks no more. It is almost time to kill them! And i could not be happier!!! The streets and homes of the rich or liberals call them what you like will be stained with the blood of the liberals so that freedom can ring for those who love thier freedom, if you dissagree, wait another 60 days or so. We killed millions of them in ww1 and ww2. Up until now freedom was for all! thankfully that is about to change, and thankfully libs cant shoot straight  lol lol hahaha. time to spread THIER wealth.

  • Andrew

    Thanks for the evidence!  I’m sure the FBI will find your Disqus trail very useful should you ever go beyond commenting on the Internet.

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