Arizona Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords Shot By Gunman

Gabrielle GiffordsVia NPR:

Rep. Gabrielle Giffords was shot in the head by a gunman at a public event in Tucson on Saturday. There are conflicting reports about whether she was killed.

The Pima County, Ariz., sheriff’s office told member station KJZZ the 40-year-old Democrat was killed. A hospital spokeswoman said Giffords was in critical condition and undergoing surgery.

At least eight other people, including members of her staff, were injured. There also were conflicting reports on the number of deaths at the scene, but President Obama, in a statement, said “we know that some have passed away” and that Giffords was “gravely wounded.”

Giffords, who was re-elected to a third term in November, was hosting a “Congress on Your Corner” event at a Safeway in northwest Tucson when a gunman ran up and started shooting, according to Peter Michaels, news director of Arizona Public Media.

The suspect fired indiscriminately from about four feet away, Michaels said. A congressional official told The Associated Press on condition of anonymity that the gunman was using an automatic weapon.

More on NPR

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  • Raymond

    Her offices were torn up after the Health Care Reform Bill vote last year. http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=10173422

  • Raymond

    Her offices were torn up after the Health Care Reform Bill vote last year. http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=10173422

    • dumbsaint
      • 5by5

        Slap the cuffs on her ignorant ass along with Glenn Beck and Limbaugh.

        Limbaugh should have been booted off the air at least for incitement to riot with his “Operation Chaos” broadcasts urging people to violence at the Democratic Convention in 2008. That kind of violent rhetoric is NOT protected speech.

        His incessant talk of violence led directly to those goobers (who fortunately were arrested before they could execute their plan) were on their way to the Convention loaded for bear with sniper rifles, flak jackets and enough ammo to take down half the stadium crowd, that intended to kill Obama during his acceptance speech.

        • fartomatic

          Wow im not a palin fan but you all are loony… what’s with the left wing fascists?

          • Tuna Ghost

            no you’re right, citing examples of violence-inciting rhetoric and consequences thereof is totally loony tunes. There is no way anyone could call you retarded or uneducated for calling this as you see it.

            No way at all.

          • MAgickrunk777

            Ever played a game and said to your opponent i am going 2 destroy you if so be-careful you maybe an extremist!! Actually you may have it backwards you all are calling for the removal of the first amendment that is fascism.

          • Tuna Ghost

            You got it all wrong buddy! I’m on your side, I’m supporting you, yeah? You’ve done well! You don’t look like a complete idiot at all! No one could say you’re ignoring the obvious because you’re not very bright. Absolutely no one. I mean that.

            Sincerely.

            Absolutely no one.

      • fack

        i bet you heard the message for race war in helter skelter ehhh?

        • dumbsaint

          I bet you failed high school, fonzy ehhhh

          • drunkerthanusual!!!!!!1!@

            aaaayyyyyyyyy!!!

          • MAgickrunk777

            This comment makes you right.

    • Haystack

      Pima County Sheriff via Yahoo News:

      The sheriff blamed the vitriolic political rhetoric that has consumed the country, much of it occurring in Arizona.
      “When you look at unbalanced people, how they respond to the vitriol that comes out of certain mouths about tearing down the government. The anger, the hatred, the bigotry that goes on in this country is getting to be outrageous,” he said. “And unfortunately, Arizona, I think, has become the capital. We have become the mecca for prejudice and bigotry.”

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  • Andrew

    Check out the comments on CNN; Republicans are calling the shooter a liberal and Democrats are calling him a Tea Partier.

    A house divided cannot stand.

  • Andrew

    Check out the comments on CNN; Republicans are calling the shooter a liberal and Democrats are calling him a Tea Partier.

    A house divided cannot stand.

    • emperorreagan

      Tea partiers showing up at protests with guns brought the assumptions on themselves…

      I’m not sure where the logic behind speculating about a liberal lies…since left-wing groups (especially in the US) typically engage in property damage rather than acts against groups/individuals.

      • O. Spengler

        The “logic” of Republican spin can be summed as follows:

        Obama is a liberal. Obama is as evil as Hitler. Hitler wrote Mein Kampf. Jared Loughner liked Mein Kampf, so Jared Loughner liked Hitler. As Hitler was as bad as Obama who is a liberal, therefore Hitler loving Jared Loughner must be a liberal.

        • Hadrian999

          that all makes perfect sense except the part about obama being a liberal

      • 5by5

        “Tea partiers showing up at protests with guns brought the assumptions on themselves…”

        EXACTLY.

    • dumbsaint

      All that spinning must make it even harder to stand

  • emperorreagan

    Tea partiers showing up at protests with guns brought the assumptions on themselves…

    I’m not sure where the logic behind speculating about a liberal lies…since left-wing groups (especially in the US) typically engage in property damage rather than acts against groups/individuals.

  • Haystack

    The Atlantic:

    Updated 5:19 p.m. The Associated Press is reporting that Jared Lee Loughner is the suspect in the shooting of 18 people, including Rep. Gabrielle Giffords, in Tuscon, Ariz., Saturday morning.
    A Jared Lee Loughner who had a MySpace page cited Mein Kampf as one of his favorite books, according to the Huffington Post, which has been taken down. Giffords is Jewish.

    A YouTube account registered to a person of the same name — Jared Loughner — had several videos on it ranting about currency, English speakers and mind control techniques.

  • Haystack

    The Atlantic:

    Updated 5:19 p.m. The Associated Press is reporting that Jared Lee Loughner is the suspect in the shooting of 18 people, including Rep. Gabrielle Giffords, in Tuscon, Ariz., Saturday morning.
    A Jared Lee Loughner who had a MySpace page cited Mein Kampf as one of his favorite books, according to the Huffington Post, which has been taken down. Giffords is Jewish.

    A YouTube account registered to a person of the same name — Jared Loughner — had several videos on it ranting about currency, English speakers and mind control techniques.

    • Haystack

      He sounds like a paranoid schizophrenic with a hard on for the Constitution. Here’s one of his YouTube rants:

      December 15, 2010:
      In conclusion, reading the second United States constitution I can’t trust the current government because of the ratifications: the government is implying mind control and brainwash on the people by controlling grammar.
      No! I won’t pay debt with a currency that’s not backed by gold and silver!
      No! I wont trust in God!

      December 15, 2010:
      The majority of people, who reside in District-8 are illiterate – hilarious. I don’t control your English grammar structure, but you control your English grammar structure.

  • WhiteRose

    Kids shooting themselves at gun shows… schools now this lets get rid of guns. Unless you are a rural farmer a stun gun will do just fine.

  • WhiteRose

    Kids shooting themselves at gun shows… schools now this lets get rid of guns. Unless you are a rural farmer a stun gun will do just fine.

    • Hadrian999

      it’ll never happen guns are one of the untouchable issues both parties use to keep their respective serfs from looking at what the parties are actually doing

    • Haystack

      I’d feel safer with a real gun.

      • StZed

        but you see the rest of us feel safer when no one has a gun.

        • poo on ur chiun

          You can’t speak for everyone buddy. I am for a Swiss style with guns and science is on my side that it is safer.

          Oh yea bet on that…. LOL

          • $4251815

            Same here. There will always be bad guys and the rest of us will always need some kind of defense…

          • razzlebathbone

            The good thing about Americans having more guns is that more Americans shoot each other.

          • $4251815

            Perhaps you hadn’t noticed, but we don’t discriminate when it comes to who gets a bullet. I think you’re just a hateful, jealous little turd; sorry your life sucks.

          • razzlebathbone

            My life would be a lot better if America would just get it overwith and start the second civil war already. Seriously, quit the fucking posturing and just get on with killing each other.

            Actually, that probably wouldn’t make my life better. A lot of people I like would probably die. But god damn it, I am getting tired of the rhetoric. Either learn to get along with people you hate or make with the slaughtering.

        • Haystack

          Someone always has a gun.

        • Tuna Ghost

          I’d feel safer with a magical unicorn that protects me from all danger. That’s not going to happen, and neither is no one having guns. Out of the dozen or so people I know who own guns, only three or so own theirs legally. Legislation on this matter isn’t really going to affect anything.

      • WhiteRose

        Unless you are a sharpshooter with fast judgment on who the good guy or bad guy/gal is could end up looking like the O.K. coral….

      • that1guy

        5 in the 5, for anyone you need to stop. The more people who learn it the better.

    • poo on ur chin

      Hey, the rampage was stopped by a guy with a gun that shot at the gun man. Think about it every shooting rampage would be stopped quickly if people had guns. Also look at china they have had a rash of mass murders with hammers and knifes this last year guess guns are not the KEY.

      • poo on ur chiun

        oh yea one more thing if you make guns illegal it only stands for law abiding citizens… criminals will still have guns.

        • WhiteRose

          Not if they can’t get bullets :)

          • MAgickrunk777

            ARE YOU THAT DUMB REALLY? i guess everything you say says yes so.

      • $4251815

        Um, no, the gunman ran out of bullets and was tackled by onlookers, including a woman. The “guy with a gun” just happened to carry a gun and didn’t even need to use it; he held the man down until police arrived.

        • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

          At least you did your homework…its painful to watch some people just spin complete bs to fill in the blanks and fit their belief system. I wonder if they think Fox will give them a phone call and ask for a job app is they tell tall enough tales?

        • Simintongue

          Not taking sides but it says in the full article the gunman still had bullets in his gun.

          • $4251815

            Well, the “man with a gun” who held the suspect down said on television, after this article was posted and before I posted my comment, that the suspect was attempting to reload when being tackled and the woman got the full clip away from him. So, I guess the full article was wrong or old news.

        • fart on ur face

          So you are saying it was still brought to an end by a innocent man with a gun? oh yes right you ust said that. LOLOLOLOL

          • $4251815

            Nobody said that. Your reading comprehension is poor.

          • FFF

            well that is what happened he got shot at and it was brought 2 an end and he had bullets left in his gun. if you can’t handle reality leave it!

  • Hadrian999

    it’ll never happen guns are one of the untouchable issues both parties use to keep their respective serfs from looking at what the parties are actually doing

  • Haystack

    I’d feel safer with a real gun.

  • http://twitter.com/Marklar_Prime Marklar Kronkite

    This sort of thing likely wouldn’t happen if the great american tradition of tarring and feathering remained legal but then C-span would look like a chicken coop 24/7.

  • Marklar_Prime

    This sort of thing likely wouldn’t happen if the great american tradition of tarring and feathering remained legal but then C-span would look like a chicken coop 24/7.

    • 5by5

      [Sarcasm Alert!] Because scalding someone’s entire body in third degree burns with hot tar is so much more civilized…..

  • StZed

    but you see the rest of us feel safer when no one has a gun.

  • Anonymous

    All that spinning must make it even harder to stand

  • poo on ur chin

    Hey, the rampage was stopped by a guy with a gun that shot at the gun man. Think about it every shooting rampage would be stopped quickly if people had guns. Also look at china they have had a rash of mass murders with hammers and knifes this last year guess guns are not the KEY.

  • poo on ur chiun

    oh yea one more thing if you make guns illegal it only stands for law abiding citizens… criminals will still have guns.

  • poo on ur chiun

    You can’t speak for everyone buddy. I am for a Swiss style with guns and science is on my side that it is safer.

    Oh yea bet on that…. LOL

  • O. Spengler

    The “logic” of Republican spin can be summed as follows:

    Obama is a liberal. Obama is as evil as Hitler. Hitler wrote Mein Kampf. Jared Loughner liked Mein Kampf, so Jared Loughner liked Hitler. As Hitler was as bad as Obama who is a liberal, therefore Hitler loving Jared Loughner must be a liberal.

  • Haystack

    Someone always has a gun.

  • Haystack

    Someone always has a gun.

  • Haystack

    Someone always has a gun.

  • Haystack

    He sounds like a paranoid schizophrenic with a hard on for the Constitution. Here’s one of his YouTube rants:

    December 15, 2010:
    In conclusion, reading the second United States constitution I can’t trust the current government because of the ratifications: the government is implying mind control and brainwash on the people by controlling grammar.
    No! I won’t pay debt with a currency that’s not backed by gold and silver!
    No! I wont trust in God!

    December 15, 2010:
    The majority of people, who reside in District-8 are illiterate – hilarious. I don’t control your English grammar structure, but you control your English grammar structure.

  • Hadrian999

    that all makes perfect sense except the part about obama being a liberal

  • Anonymous

    Um, no, the gunman ran out of bullets and was tackled by onlookers, including a woman. The “guy with a gun” just happened to carry a gun and didn’t even need to use it; he held the man down until police arrived.

  • Anonymous

    Same here. There will always be bad guys and the rest of us will always need some kind of defense…

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    I’m getting a little weary of the right re-spinning the definition of ‘left’ every time a schizoid loser with a stack of ideologies right off the right wing playbook drops off the deep end and starts shooting at Dems, libs and anyone else nearby. To date, I’ve never met a lefty who fanboys Mein Kampf…or worries about the return to a gold standard as the only hope of sustainable currency…that’s Alex Jones/Tea Party turf…which doesn’t necessarily make them responsible…but when you’ve invested your ‘brand’ in selling the notion that citizens are ‘under attack’ and that ‘the enemy’ is coming to get them, its more than a little callow to shift gears every time someone half-bent goes over the edge and takes the spiel seriously.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    I’m getting a little weary of the right re-spinning the definition of ‘left’ every time a schizoid loser with a stack of ideologies right off the right wing playbook drops off the deep end and starts shooting at Dems, libs and anyone else nearby. To date, I’ve never met a lefty who fanboys Mein Kampf…or worries about the return to a gold standard as the only hope of sustainable currency…that’s Alex Jones/Tea Party turf…which doesn’t necessarily make them responsible…but when you’ve invested your ‘brand’ in selling the notion that citizens are ‘under attack’ and that ‘the enemy’ is coming to get them, its more than a little callow to shift gears every time someone half-bent goes over the edge and takes the spiel seriously.

    • Jordan

      Our dollar doesn’t have gold to back it up. He would be a ‘fanboy’ of Mein Kampf because of the propaganda and mind control. He relates it to now, obviously. We have been under attack for a long time from the inside. I’m not pointing fingers. Our system is so fucked up, I’m sure not everybody has horrible intentions for us, but it is designed to work this way. So, everybody does it, including politicians from both sides who claim to know anything about the United States Constitution. Over time our dollar has lost 96% of its value and we have a national debt that is impossible to pay off. It’s nothing to do with left or right. I identify as a lefty and can see why this could get spun to be portrayed a right-wing redneck nutjob shit, but it’s more than that. I’m willing to bet this kid doesn’t give a shit if who he shot was Dem or Rep. Things are about to change, hope you do some research. Once everybody can get beyond the lefty/righty distraction, it’s easier to see the whole picture. There is one.

      • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

        Most of his babbling was a clear indicator of untreated schizotypal disorder…even the insane make partial sense…they draw from the same pool of material and experiences as anyone else…the difference is where they go with it from there. Debt is far less of a threat than one might imagine…even if it can lead to considerable suffering…but that kids kind of disorder doesn’t reveal anything other than that he was high-functioning, literate and deeply unstable.

        I’m primarily interested in finding out who dropped him off…the ‘missing accomplice’ in the equation. I have a strong suspicion that someone genuinely amoral gave the kid a target and fed into his delusions, armed him and dropped him off at the right time and place to do some damage.

        What I don’t appreciate is the spectacular backpedal the entire neo-con media does…minutes after screaming “They’re coming for you!! Get ready to fight back! The enemy is after you! They’ll kill everything you love if you don’t stop them by whatever means are necessary!!!”…something like this happens and the brakes shriek as they shift gears in mid-speech and try to explain why a culture that celebrates violent action 24/7 is in no way related to a mentally unstable person taking them at their word and ‘making a difference by any means necessary’.

        Do some research…let me recommend:

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia

        • FART

          SO if these neo cons are saying this give us a link 2 where these people hyping for violence are. If you can’t id say maybe you are schizophrenic i have never seen it. you know we all draw from the same pool and all its just our conclusions we come too… maybe you are insane ever thought about it?

          • poo on ur chin

            Link please

          • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

            Oh…and PS…will it be 24 hrs until you change your handle again…or is that only after you’ve burned a preset number bridges while trolling?

          • Fart magic

            I am a troll yes and i did not change anything that’s this site. I troll for common sense not finding much tho.

          • Andrew

            I support the 2nd Amendment and own a few guns myself, but I find it hypocritical how people like you accuse others of not using logic or common sense or evidence while doing little else but tossing grammatically challenged ad hominem around.

          • Poo on ur chin

            like you just did with nothing 2 debate

          • Andrew

            My ad hominem was both relevent, accurate, and grammatical, unlike all of yours.

          • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

            You mean examples other than target scopes on images of Dem candidates, machine guns being fired and waved around in political ads, language choices citing “Second Amendment remedies”…and pretty much the entire last two years of politics? Aside from all that, which you can only have missed if the rec center at your treatment facility had no TV, you want links?

            Links are a little scarce, since as of yesterday half the pols who’ve shot their mouth off have been scrubbing their sites, erasing their facebook and past tweets, and generally backpedaling like crazy…but heres one site that quickly gathered a few examples of just one politicians ‘loaded statements’ and saved them for posterity before they were purged. http://takebackthe19.com/

            That aside…listening to the right piss and bitch now is like listening to a mobster explain that “Oh…when I said take that guy and cut off his ears and shove them up his a$$…what I meant was ‘politely express my disappointment’…I have no idea how he wound up with no ears except the ones in his butt.” Somehow it just lacks credibility.

          • Logical thoughts so fAR

            what a cop out liar a target sign that obviously is there targeted districts to take that is your proof? So you can’t point to these threats because they all cleaned there sites? OK so you actually maybe schizophrenic!!

          • Tuna Ghost

            One would think the proof is in the removal of these statements. Palin herself must think they’re incendiary, after all she removed them with a quickness.

            Anyway, since you wanted references:

            Beck: “Let me tell you this, if you don’t fight on the battlefield of ideas, with your mouth, with your mind… there will be another battlefield. It will be fought with guns… I know you see what is being created… I know you see that we are being led into an American cemetery.” November 11, 2009

            THis is his schtick. “You’re going to be crushed by the Progressive menace. Your home, your kids, your everything is going to be destroyed.” And then he tells them over and over to “fight back”. You want examples of that? Those are even easier to find. Just let me know.

            I mean, that took me like seven seconds on Google. Not difficult, guy. Videos of controversial language have, surprise surprise, been removed for “copyright” reasons, despite the fact that they’ve been up for a year or more.

          • dumbsaint

            http://www.thedemocraticstrategist.org/strategist/2011/01/the_slippery_slope_of_violent.php

            This guy rebuts your shitty argument, (that seems to have been formed after you emerged from living under a rock for the past decade )

          • WONDER

            i don’t watch these people so i don’t know for sure but let me ask you one thing why no video or audio of any of these claims? heck not even a date or a time 2 reference!!!

          • dumbsaint

            Dude, you’re stretching. If you don’t watch these people then your argument is moot from the outset. You just admitted to talking about something you have no knowledge of.

            I’m from Australia where these guys aren’t even broadcast and I’m familiar with their style of rhetoric from being a media interested person.

          • fack

            so y can’t you give a video or audio of them calling for violence? i could make false quotes very easily and i don’t watch them but have tried lots 2 check peoples claims. frankly its a lot of.. well look they used cross hairs for targeted districts that means kill them. and that is rubbish

          • dumbsaint

            ‘y’, because it’s not worth my effort. Watch the news in the coming days there will be enough examples.

          • 5by5
          • Poo on ur chin

            I think you maybe right i felt like killing these targets after these videos i bet you did to. Tell me you felt it too!! Oh wait only lunatics defer killing rather the political removal. So i bet you want to get rid of the first amendment too stop this? If i told you to eat shit and die is that a threat? Ever played a game and said to your opponent i am going 2 destroy you if so be-careful you maybe an extremist!!

          • Tuna Ghost

            You’ve responded very well to being proved completely wrong in everything you’ve stated thus far. No one could possibly believe you’re some sort of idiot who doesn’t know what he’s talking about and has no leg to stand on.

            No one.

      • Andrew

        Gold doesn’t have food or shelter to back it up.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    At least you did your homework…its painful to watch some people just spin complete bs to fill in the blanks and fit their belief system. I wonder if they think Fox will give them a phone call and ask for a job app is they tell tall enough tales?

  • Anonymous

    The good thing about Americans having more guns is that more Americans shoot each other.

  • Anonymous
  • Kali23Yuga

    Funny to see the usual disinfo suspects cheer about legalization of marihuana, while urging to ban guns. “It just doesn’t work, the war on drugs”.
    What makes you think a war against weaponry will do the trick?

  • Kali23Yuga

    Funny to see the usual disinfo suspects cheer about legalization of marihuana, while urging to ban guns. “It just doesn’t work, the war on drugs”.
    What makes you think a war against weaponry will do the trick?

    • David Frost

      I hate to break it to you but Arizona is one of those states that thinks the second amendment is the greatest thing ever.

    • Anonymous

      yeah, cause we all know guns and plant matter are pretty much the same thing.

    • http://www.disinfo.com Disinformation

      This asshole killed a child…

    • WhiteRose

      You are comparing apples and oranges. Only the police and those that live in rural areas where the police are too far and few between should be allowed to carry guns. What a knife, pepper spray, stun gun isn’t enough protection for you? Then grow some balls!

      • Kali23Yuga

        Oh, and you think that will solve the killing spree?
        I’m from Belgium and that’s exactly the case. Instead of guns, criminals carry knives over here, though the big gangsters still have guns, obviously. And when it comes down to it, the law abiding citizens can’t defend themselves against these thugs.
        If you want to kill, there’s no stopping you. A few years ago we had a psycho stabbing toddlers to death over here. A ban on guns didn’t stop him. And there have been other cases where people could’ve easily protected their families when they had the right to bear arms.

        • Bhornbuckle75

          You do realize that what you are suggesting has no basis in reality. Statistically it is EXTRAORDINARILY rare that an individual is ever in a position to successfully protect himself with a gun. Don’t believe me? Look it up. In fact it is so statistically rare as to be a pretty much non-existent, at least in the sense that its far below a level that can even be considered statistically important. Its actually far more likely to accidentaly kill yourself or someone near you while you are handling a gun, than it is that you will kill or wound someone who is attacking you. Such a scenerio as “law abiding citizens” defending themselves against “gangsters” is something that really only happens in the movies. Now, I am not the type to suggest they should be banned all together.I have no problem with the Idea of someone collecting guns as a hobby, or using them in sport. However I am all for making the buying of them a much more intensive process, with as many safety precautions and background checks as we can possibly include. Also as for the “psycho stabbing toddlers” is concerned….yeah getting rid of guns is obviously not going to get rid of violent psychotic individuals…nor is it going to get rid of criminals or violent people in general. People will stay pretty much the same as they always have been. But you miss the point entirely with your arguments. You see, no one is suggesting that getting rid of guns will stop madmen. The point is that by banning guns you will make it MUCH less likely that a psychotic individual will be able to get a hold of one…..this is the difference between such an individual stabbing a few toddlers….and going to the maternity ward of a very large hospital and killing every single infant there, along with the moms, doctors, dads, nurses, janitors, and whoever else unlucky enough to have been there.

          • Kali23Yuga

            Ok,you’re right on what you note here. But my original point was not : “guns don’t kill people, people kill people”. I just think we have to be careful to not turn societal issues in a gun-issue f.e. Because we then tend to battle the symptons and not the root of the problem.
            But this may as well be an isolated case, instead of a societal issue that has its radical offshoots. We have to wait and see what the culprit’s motives were.

          • Effortlessmentality

            I’m in a half-agreement with you here.

            The whole “guns don’t kill people” argument is almost true. I’m from Arkansas, nearly everyone here has guns in their houses, but where I live has one of the lowest violent crime rates in the country.

            However, guns do kill people because that’s what they’re designed to do. There is no purpose for a gun other than to injure. And so… yes and no. But you’re right: we shouldn’t confuse cause and effect.

      • Effortlessmentality

        I agree that guns are sissy weapons, don’t get me wrong.

        But it’s a sign of the times. Knife vs. gun doesn’t win too often. Even if we did outlaw guns to the public, the kind of person who would mug you isn’t going to obtain a gun by legal means anyhow.

    • 5by5

      Legalized Marijuana isn’t killing people. Criminalizing it is.

      The reverse is true for guns.

      • Effortlessmentality

        Let’s say we do outlaw guns and legalize marijuana. We’d end up in the exact same boat we are already. People would have marijuana and abuse it, and people would illegally own guns they obtain from the black market. The only thing that would change is hunting fans would be in jail instead of pot-smokers.

      • Effortlessmentality

        Not to mention that criminalized marijuana isn’t killing anyone. In fact, in most places it’s de-prioritized, meaning the cops aren’t even really looking for it. If they catch you with it, yeah, they’ll still hit you with a possession charge, but they aren’t going door-to-door to catch you.

        So they might stick you in jail for a bit and make you pay some money, they’re not executing anyone. S no, it’s not killing anybody.

    • MAgickrunk777

      because it is a religion for NEOlib TARds they don’t need logic or science.

  • David Frost

    I hate to break it to you but Arizona is one of those states that thinks the second amendment is the greatest thing ever.

  • Anonymous

    yeah, cause we all know guns and plant matter are pretty much the same thing.

  • Haystack

    Pima County Sheriff via Yahoo News:

    The sheriff blamed the vitriolic political rhetoric that has consumed the country, much of it occurring in Arizona.
    “When you look at unbalanced people, how they respond to the vitriol that comes out of certain mouths about tearing down the government. The anger, the hatred, the bigotry that goes on in this country is getting to be outrageous,” he said. “And unfortunately, Arizona, I think, has become the capital. We have become the mecca for prejudice and bigotry.”

  • Simintongue

    Not taking sides but it says in the full article the gunman still had bullets in his gun.

  • fart on ur face

    So you are saying it was still brought to an end by a innocent man with a gun? oh yes right you ust said that. LOLOLOLOL

  • Jordan

    This goes far beyond Democrat and Republican, left-wing and right-wing… Have you watched this dude’s YouTube videos? youtube.com/classitup10 This kid knows what he is talking about, although his writing style is ‘different’ and is easy to call crazy. Fact is, we don’t know exactly what motivated this. We can speculate all day long. But why? Thankfully this kid didn’t kill himself afterwards and we may get to hear what he has to say. Oh, and did I mention Gabby Giffords is a miracle? She got shot in the head and will live to tell about it. I’m not justifying his behavior, however, Jared Loughner is educated. He lists his favorite books as Mein Kampf and The Communist Manifesto. His ‘rants’ about currency are completely accurate, considering it is mathematically impossible to pay off the national debt. Federal Reserve, anybody? He is essentially saying our government, including schools and police are operating unconstitutionally. He mentions grammar and its importance because our Constitution is now being ripped apart and is apparently now open for interpretation like it’s the Bible or something. I don’t support the Tea Party, nor do I have a ‘hard-on for the constitution.’ I consider myself a liberal. I’m not going to speculate why exactly he targeted who he targeted, as you can all do that for yourselves, but I think it’s extremely possible he was just killing politicians, period. This goes above our government as we all know it. This kid is onto something. It is obvious he studied, stumbled upon the truth like we do, got scared, freaked out, and said f*ck this. There is much more to come from what happened today.

  • Jordan

    This goes far beyond Democrat and Republican, left-wing and right-wing… Have you watched this dude’s YouTube videos? youtube.com/classitup10 This kid knows what he is talking about, although his writing style is ‘different’ and is easy to call crazy. Fact is, we don’t know exactly what motivated this. We can speculate all day long. But why? Thankfully this kid didn’t kill himself afterwards and we may get to hear what he has to say. Oh, and did I mention Gabby Giffords is a miracle? She got shot in the head and will live to tell about it. I’m not justifying his behavior, however, Jared Loughner is educated. He lists his favorite books as Mein Kampf and The Communist Manifesto. His ‘rants’ about currency are completely accurate, considering it is mathematically impossible to pay off the national debt. Federal Reserve, anybody? He is essentially saying our government, including schools and police are operating unconstitutionally. He mentions grammar and its importance because our Constitution is now being ripped apart and is apparently now open for interpretation like it’s the Bible or something. I don’t support the Tea Party, nor do I have a ‘hard-on for the constitution.’ I consider myself a liberal. I’m not going to speculate why exactly he targeted who he targeted, as you can all do that for yourselves, but I think it’s extremely possible he was just killing politicians, period. This goes above our government as we all know it. This kid is onto something. It is obvious he studied, stumbled upon the truth like we do, got scared, freaked out, and said f*ck this. There is much more to come from what happened today.

    • Tuna Ghost

      Jared Loughner is educated. He lists his favorite books as Mein Kampf and The Communist Manifesto.

      I can’t believe I have to ask this, but are you mentioning this as evidence he was “educated”?

      This kid is onto something. It is obvious he studied, stumbled upon the truth like we do, got scared, freaked out, and said f*ck this.

      I have a different explanation: he suffers from a mental disorder, which was further fueled by the local political shenanigans, and then he shot innocent people.

      • http://hormeticminds.blogspot.com/ Chaorder Gradient

        I never liked the umbrella explanation of “a mental disorder”. It has equal weight in saying the guy has a complex mind, so complex that none can nor should try to figure out the reasoning behind it. Furthermore, “mental disorders” always have causes, which are rarely caused by the common conceptions of psychoanalytic theories of “hating your father” or some other crock. Could just learning things about reality cause a “mental disorder” and if so, can we really call it a disorder if it is at its base grounded in reality?

        I get the feeling that this is more a symptom of a partially and chaotically awakening populace. There are many people who get mad and do something crazy. Hell, there are a lot of things out there to get mad about, maybe he only found 1 or 10 of them out of the millions and tried to fight the air of powerlessness and madness.

        • dumbsaint

          The guy shot a 9 year old in the head. Mental disorder is being polite in this instance.

        • Tuna Ghost

          It has equal weight in saying the guy has a complex mind, so complex that none can nor should try to figure out the reasoning behind it.

          All minds are complex, despite our urges to label them otherwise when someone acts like an idiot. His mind is no more or less complex than yours or mine, its simply dealing with different stimuli or processing it in a very different way. This is no reason to not make an attempt to understand them.

          Furthermore, “mental disorders” always have causes, which are rarely caused by the common conceptions of psychoanalytic theories of “hating your father” or some other crock.

          Well, they do and they don’t. We still know very little about neurological disorders like autism, and schitzophrenia is still poorly understood. If you mean they always have physical causes, then once again–they do and they don’t.

          I don’t think its helpful to claim, as some have, that exposure to an awful truth warped the poor man’s mind and turned him into what he is today. Far more likely is that he has been suffering an undiagnosed mental disorder for some time, and his neurosis was fueled by politics (I know mine are, certainly).

        • Effortlessmentality

          “Mental disorder” is such a loose term these days that it’s practically an excuse for saying “we don’t know”. I think that it’s quite the opposite. People who make those kinds of decisions do them because they’re set on the belief that it’s the right thing to do.

          Although I will agree that genius and insanity are hard to separate at times, I think that this boy knew full-well what he was doing and the consequences of doing so. So mentally disordered? No. Not at all.

      • Effortlessmentality

        I would say reading those books in this country would mark one as educated. Or at least open-minded enough to give it a shot. I’m of the firm belief that reading of any material more educational than Twilight is worthwhile. Perhaps you should read them.

        “It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.” – Aristotle

    • Effortlessmentality

      If his favorite books are two of probably the most historically controversial political books in history, and he shot a republican representative, I think a motive can be fairly easily assumed. Whether or not such an assumption would be accurate is anyone’s guess, but I think that a political ideal (or rebellion) would be a pretty obvious answer.

  • Jordan

    Our dollar doesn’t have gold to back it up. He would be a ‘fanboy’ of Mein Kampf because of the propaganda and mind control. He relates it to now, obviously. We have been under attack for a long time from the inside. I’m not pointing fingers. Our system is so fucked up, I’m sure not everybody has horrible intentions for us, but it is designed to work this way. So, everybody does it, including politicians from both sides who claim to know anything about the United States Constitution. Over time our dollar has lost 96% of its value and we have a national debt that is impossible to pay off. It’s nothing to do with left or right. I identify as a lefty and can see why this could get spun to be portrayed a right-wing redneck nutjob shit, but it’s more than that. I’m willing to bet this kid doesn’t give a shit if who he shot was Dem or Rep. Things are about to change, hope you do some research. Once everybody can get beyond the lefty/righty distraction, it’s easier to see the whole picture. There is one.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    Most of his babbling was a clear indicator of untreated schizotypal disorder…even the insane make partial sense…they draw from the same pool of material and experiences as anyone else…the difference is where they go with it from there. Debt is far less of a threat than one might imagine…even if it can lead to considerable suffering…but that kids kind of disorder doesn’t reveal anything other than that he was high-functioning, literate and deeply unstable.

    I’m primarily interested in finding out who dropped him off…the ‘missing accomplice’ in the equation. I have a strong suspicion that someone genuinely amoral gave the kid a target and fed into his delusions, armed him and dropped him off at the right time and place to do some damage.

    What I don’t appreciate is the spectacular backpedal the entire neo-con media does…minutes after screaming “They’re coming for you!! Get ready to fight back! The enemy is after you! They’ll kill everything you love if you don’t stop them by whatever means are necessary!!!”…something like this happens and the brakes shriek as they shift gears in mid-speech and try to explain why a culture that celebrates violent action 24/7 is in no way related to a mentally unstable person taking them at their word and ‘making a difference by any means necessary’.

    Do some research…let me recommend:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia

  • http://disinfo.com Disinformation

    This asshole killed a child…

  • Tuna Ghost

    Jared Loughner is educated. He lists his favorite books as Mein Kampf and The Communist Manifesto.

    I can’t believe I have to ask this, but are you mentioning this as evidence he was “educated”?

    This kid is onto something. It is obvious he studied, stumbled upon the truth like we do, got scared, freaked out, and said f*ck this.

    I have a different explanation: he suffers from a mental disorder, which was further fueled by the local political shenanigans, and then he shot innocent people.

  • Tuna Ghost

    I’d feel safer with a magical unicorn that protects me from all danger. That’s not going to happen, and neither is no one having guns. Out of the dozen or so people I know who own guns, only three or so own theirs legally. Legislation on this matter isn’t really going to affect anything.

  • 5by5

    Arrest Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh for incitement.

  • 5by5

    Arrest Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh for incitement.

  • 5by5

    “Tea partiers showing up at protests with guns brought the assumptions on themselves…”

    EXACTLY.

  • WhiteRose

    You are comparing apples and oranges. Only the police and those that live in rural areas where the police are too far and few between should be allowed to carry guns. What a knife, pepper spray, stun gun isn’t enough protection for you? Then grow some balls!

  • WhiteRose

    Not if they can’t get bullets :)

  • 5by5

    The little girl who was shot by this asshat? Just found out that she was born on Sept 11th 2001.

  • 5by5

    The little girl who was shot by this asshat? Just found out that she was born on Sept 11th 2001.

  • WhiteRose

    Unless you are a sharpshooter with fast judgment on who the good guy or bad guy/gal is could end up looking like the O.K. coral….

  • 5by5

    The Congresswoman herself is married to astronaut Mark Kelly, who piloted the Endeavor and the Discovery Shuttle, and his brother is an astronaut currently serving aboard the International Space Station.

    The most recent report is that Congresswoman Giffords is one tough mother, who, according to U.S. Surgeon General Richard Carmona, is “conscious and responsive after brain surgery.”

    I hope she survives to fight another day, and promptly proceeds to kick ass in Congress fighting for regular folks tomorrow just like she did in the past.

    Sadly, though, Federal Judge John Roll did not survive the attack. For real irony, you should also know that he was one of a few judges who ruled that the Brady gun law’s requirement that a records check by local authorities before a gun purchase violates the Constitutional’s 10th Amendment. While I disagree with that, as a jurist he very proactively defended civil rights, and ruled in favor of protecting wildlife preserves from excessive large development interests, so on balance, I think he was a good jurist. Either way, he didn’t deserve this shit.

  • 5by5

    The Congresswoman herself is married to astronaut Mark Kelly, who piloted the Endeavor and the Discovery Shuttle, and his brother is an astronaut currently serving aboard the International Space Station.

    The most recent report is that Congresswoman Giffords is one tough mother, who, according to U.S. Surgeon General Richard Carmona, is “conscious and responsive after brain surgery.”

    I hope she survives to fight another day, and promptly proceeds to kick ass in Congress fighting for regular folks tomorrow just like she did in the past.

    Sadly, though, Federal Judge John Roll did not survive the attack. For real irony, you should also know that he was one of a few judges who ruled that the Brady gun law’s requirement that a records check by local authorities before a gun purchase violates the Constitutional’s 10th Amendment. While I disagree with that, as a jurist he very proactively defended civil rights, and ruled in favor of protecting wildlife preserves from excessive large development interests, so on balance, I think he was a good jurist. Either way, he didn’t deserve this shit.

  • 5by5

    Congresswoman Giffords also was also a strong supporter of gun ownership rights. So ironically, the gun lobby just lost at least one supporter, and has another severely wounded… by a gun nut.

  • 5by5

    Congresswoman Giffords also was also a strong supporter of gun ownership rights. So ironically, the gun lobby just lost at least one supporter, and has another severely wounded… by a gun nut.

    • Guest

      Gun nut or a nut with a gun?

  • 5by5

    Legalized Marijuana isn’t killing people. Criminalizing it is.

    The reverse is true for guns.

  • 5by5

    Slap the cuffs on her ignorant ass along with Glenn Beck and Limbaugh.

    Limbaugh should have been booted off the air at least for incitement to riot with his “Operation Chaos” broadcasts urging people to violence at the Democratic Convention in 2008. That kind of violent rhetoric is NOT protected speech.

    His incessant talk of violence led directly to those goobers (who fortunately were arrested before they could execute their plan) were on their way to the Convention loaded for bear with sniper rifles, flak jackets and enough ammo to take down half the stadium crowd, that intended to kill Obama during his acceptance speech.

  • 5by5

    I also find it interesting what books each side is pulling out of his MySpace page to support their desperate attempts to try to place the guy on one side of the political spectrum or the other, in order to place the blame for this on that side.

    Here is the FULL list of books this jerk said he liked:

    “Animal Farm, Brave New World, The Wizard Of OZ, Aesop Fables, The Odyssey, Alice Adventures Into Wonderland, Fahrenheit 451, Peter Pan, To Kill A Mockingbird, We The Living, Phantom Toll Booth, One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest, Pulp,Through The Looking Glass, The Communist Manifesto, Siddhartha, The Old Man And The Sea, Gulliver’s Travels, Mein Kampf, The Republic, and Meno.”

    Big range there, so frankly, no real indicators of anything.

    Personally, I’d be more curious what he LISTENED to on a daily basis, and this being Arizona, I’m betting on gobs of rightwing radio.

    The root cause here is that this guy is a bucket of crazy.

    But ultimately, the larger problem ironically isn’t with the crazy people (who are gonna be crazy because that’s where their brains are at), it’s with the sane people who either do nothing or exacerbate the problem. The ones who think that they can use trigger language like Limbaugh, Hannity, Palin, Cheney, “Bring it On” Bush, or Beck, and that they have no responsibility for the consequences that happen later as a result of their words. The problem is also with the lack of funding for, or focus on, mental health care (that ironically the Congresswoman was fighting to improve access to).

  • 5by5

    I also find it interesting what books each ideological side is pulling out of his MySpace page to support their desperate attempts to try to place the guy on one side of the political spectrum or the other, in order to place the blame for this on that side.

    Here is the FULL list of books this jerk said he liked:

    “Animal Farm, Brave New World, The Wizard Of OZ, Aesop Fables, The Odyssey, Alice Adventures Into Wonderland, Fahrenheit 451, Peter Pan, To Kill A Mockingbird, We The Living, Phantom Toll Booth, One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest, Pulp,Through The Looking Glass, The Communist Manifesto, Siddhartha, The Old Man And The Sea, Gulliver’s Travels, Mein Kampf, The Republic, and Meno.”

    Big range there, so frankly, no real indicators of anything.

    Personally, I’d be more curious what he LISTENED to on a daily basis as that’s a much stronger trigger mechanism than a book, and this being Arizona, I’m betting on gobs of rightwing radio.

    The root cause here is that this guy is a bucket of crazy.

    But ultimately, the larger problem ironically isn’t with the crazy people (who are gonna be crazy because that’s where their brains are at), it’s with the sane people who either do nothing or exacerbate the problem. The ones who think that they can use trigger language like Limbaugh, Hannity, Palin, Cheney, “Bring it On” Bush, or Beck, and that they have no responsibility for the consequences that happen later as a result of their words. The problem is also with the lack of funding for, or focus on, mental health care (that ironically the Congresswoman was fighting to improve access to).

    • Haystack

      “To Kill A Mockingbird”

      Fucking Harper Lee. I knew she was behind this.

    • Bhornbuckle75

      What….no CATCHER IN THE RYE?!?! LOL!!! Seriously though, You hit the nail right on the head! Its been somewhat amusing to read blogs, or articles where people refer to him as a Right Wing Fascist, Racist, where they will list Mein Kampf as one of his favorite books…..then I will read another article that says he was a Left Wing Liberal, mentioning The Communist Manifesto!!! Basically from all the information I have found it seems clear that this kid was just really mentally screwed up. You can see it in his bizarre YouTube video posts where he is obsessed with grammar, and has extremely hard to follow, or comprehend logic. On one hand…I don’t mind the politicians using this as a way to tune down the Hate Speech that has been coming from both parties about each other….but the part of me that values the Truth above all else feels compelled to point out that their claims of him following one particular wing of the political machine is just pretty far off the mark. His political views (from the info available at least) seems to be extreme, yet contradictory, and confused.

  • 5by5

    Apparently, the Congresswoman herself was pointing out the consequences of violent rhetoric on Rachael Maddow’s show in March of last year:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tTDiZZYCAs
    http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/01/giffords-warned-march-consequences-palins-violent-rhetoric/

  • 5by5

    It seems the Congresswoman herself was pointing out the consequences of violent rhetoric on Rachael Maddow’s show as far back as March of last year:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tTDiZZYCAs
    http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/01/giffords-warned-march-consequences-palins-violent-rhetoric/

    Apparently uncomfortable with the reality of this, Faux News cut away from the vigil, when a mourner dared to mention Palin’s role in all of this:

    http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/01/fox-news-abruptly-cuts-tucson-vigil-mourner-mentions-sarah-palin/

  • 5by5

    A total of 19 people were shot and 6 people were killed.

    Below are the names of the people killed:

    John Roll, 63

    Dorthy Murray, 76

    Dorwin Stoddard, 76

    Christina Greene, 9

    Phyllis Scheck, 79

    Gabriel Zimmerman, 30

  • 5by5

    A total of 19 people were shot and 6 people were killed.

    Below are the names of the people killed:

    John Roll, 63

    Dorthy Murray, 76

    Dorwin Stoddard, 76

    Christina Greene, 9

    Phyllis Scheck, 79

    Gabriel Zimmerman, 30

  • 5by5

    Since few people know about the actions of Congress people outside their own Representative, here is some of the work Giffords has done so far on behalf of the country.

    — As a member of the Science and Technology Committee and someone who was trying to improve our national security by getting us off our dependence on foreign oil, Congresswoman Giffords authored the Solar Energy Research and Advancement Act of 2007 “To support the research, development, and commercial application of solar energy technologies”. She was also aware that because Arizona is a sunny state, that solar energy production would also bring in much-needed JOBS to the state, so she was a big advocate of advancing this clean energy alternative.

    — She was advocating for a 5% pay reduction for Congressmembers.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=riqAYIevV08

    — She co-sponsoed the America Competes Act which will award grants from the National Science Foundation to grad students in science, technology, engineering and math to prepare for careers outside academia, develop and expand science and tech parks to inform the general public about scientific advancements, and doubles the funding over the next 10 years for the Department of Energy Office of Science, the National Science Foundation and the National Institute of Standards and Technology labs.

    — She sponsored four bills to improve educational opportinities and access to health care for our veterans, including the Post-9/11 GI Bill Patch Act (H.R. 4064), the Veterans and Survivors Behavioral Health Awareness Act (H.R. 2698), the Armed Forces Behavioral Health Awareness Act (H.R. 2699), and the Reserve Component Retirement Retirement Equity Act (H.R. 1695).

    — She also supported 11 bills to improve border security, including the Emergency Supplemental Appropriation for Border Security of 2010 (H.R. 6080), the Deployment of the National Guard to the Border (H.Con.Res.273), and the New Employee Verification Act (NEVA) – H.R. 5515 and H.R. 2028, among others.

  • 5by5

    Since few people know about the actions of Congress people outside their own Representative, here is some of the work Giffords has done so far on behalf of the country.

    — As a member of the Science and Technology Committee and someone who was trying to improve our national security by getting us off our dependence on foreign oil, Congresswoman Giffords authored the Solar Energy Research and Advancement Act of 2007 “To support the research, development, and commercial application of solar energy technologies”. She was also aware that because Arizona is a sunny state, that solar energy production would also bring in much-needed JOBS to the state, so she was a big advocate of advancing this clean energy alternative.

    — She was advocating for a 5% pay reduction for Congressmembers.

    — She co-sponsoed the America Competes Act which will award grants from the National Science Foundation to grad students in science, technology, engineering and math to prepare for careers outside academia, develop and expand science and tech parks to inform the general public about scientific advancements, and doubles the funding over the next 10 years for the Department of Energy Office of Science, the National Science Foundation and the National Institute of Standards and Technology labs.

    — She sponsored four bills to improve educational opportinities and access to health care for our veterans, including the Post-9/11 GI Bill Patch Act (H.R. 4064), the Veterans and Survivors Behavioral Health Awareness Act (H.R. 2698), the Armed Forces Behavioral Health Awareness Act (H.R. 2699), and the Reserve Component Retirement Retirement Equity Act (H.R. 1695).

    — She also supported 11 bills to improve border security, including the Emergency Supplemental Appropriation for Border Security of 2010 (H.R. 6080), the Deployment of the National Guard to the Border (H.Con.Res.273), and the New Employee Verification Act (NEVA) – H.R. 5515 and H.R. 2028, among others.

  • Guest

    Gun nut or a nut with a gun?

  • Kali23Yuga

    Oh, and you think that will solve the killing spree?
    I’m from Belgium and that’s exactly the case. Instead of guns, criminals carry knives over here, though the big gangsters still have guns, obviously. And when it comes down to it, the law abiding citizens can’t defend themselves against these thugs.
    If you want to kill, there’s no stopping you. A few years ago we had a psycho stabbing toddlers to death over here. A ban on guns didn’t stop him. And there have been other cases where people could’ve easily protected their families when they had the right to bear arms.

  • Anonymous

    Well, the “man with a gun” who held the suspect down said on television, after this article was posted and before I posted my comment, that the suspect was attempting to reload when being tackled and the woman got the full clip away from him. So, I guess the full article was wrong or old news.

  • Anonymous

    Nobody said that. Your reading comprehension is poor.

  • Anonymous

    Perhaps you hadn’t noticed, but we don’t discriminate when it comes to who gets a bullet. I think you’re just a hateful, jealous little turd; sorry your life sucks.

  • FFF

    well that is what happened he got shot at and it was brought 2 an end and he had bullets left in his gun. if you can’t handle reality leave it!

  • MAgickrunk777

    ARE YOU THAT DUMB REALLY? i guess everything you say says yes so.

  • MAgickrunk777

    because it is a religion for NEOlib TARds they don’t need logic or science.

  • FART

    SO if these neo cons are saying this give us a link 2 where these people hyping for violence are. If you can’t id say maybe you are schizophrenic i have never seen it. you know we all draw from the same pool and all its just our conclusions we come too… maybe you are insane ever thought about it?

  • fartomatic

    Wow im not a palin fan but you all are loony… what’s with the left wing fascists?

  • poo on ur chin

    Link please

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    You mean examples other than target scopes on images of Dem candidates, machine guns being fired and waved around in political ads, language choices citing “Second Amendment remedies”…and pretty much the entire last two years of politics? Aside from all that, which you can only have missed if the rec center at your treatment facility had no TV, you want links?

    Links are a little scarce, since as of yesterday half the pols who’ve shot their mouth off have been scrubbing their sites, erasing their facebook and past tweets, and generally backpedaling like crazy…but heres one site that quickly gathered a few examples of just one politicians ‘loaded statements’ and saved them for posterity before they were purged. http://takebackthe19.com/

    That aside…listening to the right piss and bitch now is like listening to a mobster explain that “Oh…when I said take that guy and cut off his ears and shove them up his a$$…what I meant was ‘politely express my disappointment’…I have no idea how he wound up with no ears except the ones in his butt.” Somehow it just lacks credibility.

  • http://voxmagi-necessarywords.blogspot.com/ VoxMagi

    Oh…and PS…will it be 24 hrs until you change your handle again…or is that only after you’ve burned a preset number bridges while trolling?

  • http://hormeticminds.blogspot.com/ Chaorder Gradient

    I never liked the umbrella explanation of “a mental disorder”. It has equal weight in saying the guy has a complex mind, so complex that none can nor should try to figure out the reasoning behind it. Furthermore, “mental disorders” always have causes, which are rarely caused by the common conceptions of psychoanalytic theories of “hating your father” or some other crock. Could just learning things about reality cause a “mental disorder” and if so, can we really call it a disorder if it is at its base grounded in reality?

    I get the feeling that this is more a symptom of a partially and chaotically awakening populace. There are many people who get mad and do something crazy. Hell, there are a lot of things out there to get mad about, maybe he only found 1 or 10 of them out of the millions and tried to fight the air of powerlessness and madness.

  • Logical thoughts so fAR

    what a cop out liar a target sign that obviously is there targeted districts to take that is your proof? So you can’t point to these threats because they all cleaned there sites? OK so you actually maybe schizophrenic!!

  • Fart magic

    I am a troll yes and i did not change anything that’s this site. I troll for common sense not finding much tho.

  • Fart magic

    this is MA 2 disinfo likes to mess with my name it seems

  • http://twitter.com/allllessahilton Alessa Hilton

    I’d feel safer with a magical unicorn that protects me from all danger. That’s not going to happen, and neither is no one having guns. Out of the dozen or so people I know who own guns, only three or so own theirs legally. Legislation on this matter isn’t really going to affect anything. . -agree !

    how to win the lottery

  • http://twitter.com/allllessahilton Alessa Hilton

    I’d feel safer with a magical unicorn that protects me from all danger. That’s not going to happen, and neither is no one having guns. Out of the dozen or so people I know who own guns, only three or so own theirs legally. Legislation on this matter isn’t really going to affect anything. . -agree !

    how to win the lottery

  • Anonymous

    http://www.thedemocraticstrategist.org/strategist/2011/01/the_slippery_slope_of_violent.php

    This guy rebuts your shitty argument, (that seems to have been formed after you emerged from living under a rock for the past decade )

  • WONDER

    i don’t watch these people so i don’t know for sure but let me ask you one thing why no video or audio of any of these claims? heck not even a date or a time 2 reference!!!

  • Andrew

    Gold doesn’t have food or shelter to back it up.

  • Anonymous

    Dude, you’re stretching. If you don’t watch these people then your argument is moot from the outset. You just admitted to talking about something you have no knowledge of.

    I’m from Australia where these guys aren’t even broadcast and I’m familiar with their style of rhetoric from being a media interested person.

  • Haystack

    “To Kill A Mockingbird”

    Fucking Harper Lee. I knew she was behind this.

  • fack

    so y can’t you give a video or audio of them calling for violence? i could make false quotes very easily and i don’t watch them but have tried lots 2 check peoples claims. frankly its a lot of.. well look they used cross hairs for targeted districts that means kill them. and that is rubbish

  • fack

    i bet you heard the message for race war in helter skelter ehhh?

  • Anonymous

    ‘y’, because it’s not worth my effort. You’re a reactionary moron.

  • Anonymous

    I bet you failed high school, fonzy ehhhh

  • Anonymous

    The guy shot a 9 year old in the head. Mental disorder is being polite in this instance.

  • Bhornbuckle75

    You do realize that what you are suggesting has no basis in reality. Statistically it is EXTRAORDINARILY rare that an individual is ever in a position to successfully protect himself with a gun. Don’t believe me? Look it up. In fact it is so statistically rare as to be a pretty much non-existent, at least in the sense that its far below a level that can even be considered statistically important. Its actually far more likely to accidentaly kill yourself or someone near you while you are handling a gun, than it is that you will kill or wound someone who is attacking you. Such a scenerio as “law abiding citizens” defending themselves against “gangsters” is something that really only happens in the movies. Now, I am not the type to suggest they should be banned all together.I have no problem with the Idea of someone collecting guns as a hobby, or using them in sport. However I am all for making the buying of them a much more intensive process, with as many safety precautions and background checks as we can possibly include. Also as for the “psycho stabbing toddlers” is concerned….yeah getting rid of guns is obviously not going to get rid of violent psychotic individuals…nor is it going to get rid of criminals or violent people in general. People will stay pretty much the same as they always have been. But you miss the point entirely with your arguments. You see, no one is suggesting that getting rid of guns will stop madmen. The point is that by banning guns you will make it MUCH less likely that a psychotic individual will be able to get a hold of one…..this is the difference between such an individual stabbing a few toddlers….and going to the maternity ward of a very large hospital and killing every single infant there, along with the moms, doctors, dads, nurses, janitors, and whoever else unlucky enough to have been there.

  • Bhornbuckle75

    What….no CATCHER IN THE RYE?!?! LOL!!! Seriously though, You hit the nail right on the head! Its been somewhat amusing to read blogs, or articles where people refer to him as a Right Wing Fascist, Racist, where they will list Mein Kampf as one of his favorite books…..then I will read another article that says he was a Left Wing Liberal, mentioning The Communist Manifesto!!! Basically from all the information I have found it seems clear that this kid was just really mentally screwed up. You can see it in his bizarre YouTube video posts where he is obsessed with grammar, and has extremely hard to follow, or comprehend logic. On one hand…I don’t mind the politicians using this as a way to tune down the Hate Speech that has been coming from both parties about each other….but the part of me that values the Truth above all else feels compelled to point out that their claims of him following one particular wing of the political machine is just pretty far off the mark. His political views (from the info available at least) seems to be extreme, yet contradictory, and confused.

  • Andrew

    I support the 2nd Amendment and own a few guns myself, but I find it hypocritical how people like you accuse others of not using logic or common sense or evidence while doing little else but tossing grammatically challenged ad hominem around.

  • Tuna Ghost

    It has equal weight in saying the guy has a complex mind, so complex that none can nor should try to figure out the reasoning behind it.

    All minds are complex, despite our urges to label them otherwise when someone acts like an idiot. His mind is no more or less complex than yours or mine, its simply dealing with different stimuli or processing it in a very different way. This is no reason to not make an attempt to understand them.

    Furthermore, “mental disorders” always have causes, which are rarely caused by the common conceptions of psychoanalytic theories of “hating your father” or some other crock.

    Well, they do and they don’t. We still know very little about neurological disorders like autism, and schitzophrenia is still poorly understood. If you mean they always have physical causes, then once again–they do and they don’t.

    I don’t think its helpful to claim, as some have, that exposure to an awful truth warped the poor man’s mind and turned him into what he is today. Far more likely is that he has been suffering an undiagnosed mental disorder for some time, and his neurosis was fueled by politics (I know mine are, certainly).

  • Tuna Ghost

    no you’re right, citing examples of violence-inciting rhetoric and consequences thereof is totally loony tunes. There is no way anyone could call you retarded or uneducated for calling this as you see it.

    No way at all.

  • Anonymous

    My life would be a lot better if America would just get it overwith and start the second civil war already. Seriously, quit the fucking posturing and just get on with killing each other.

    Actually, that probably wouldn’t make my life better. A lot of people I like would probably die. But god damn it, I am getting tired of the rhetoric. Either learn to get along with people you hate or make with the slaughtering.

  • Anonymous

    My life would be a lot better if America would just get it overwith and start the second civil war already. Seriously, quit the fucking posturing and just get on with killing each other.

    Actually, that probably wouldn’t make my life better. A lot of people I like would probably die. But god damn it, I am getting tired of the rhetoric. Either learn to get along with people you hate or make with the slaughtering.

  • drunkerthanusual

    Can i call people fucktards and still have my opinions respected elsewhere? Who cares? You, sir, are a fucktard. Go learn something, anything.

  • drunkerthanusual

    again. magaaa aa fuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

  • that1guy

    5 in the 5, for anyone you need to stop. The more people who learn it the better.

  • drunkerthanusual!!!!!!1!@

    aaaayyyyyyyyy!!!

  • Grmann1001

    Big Brother and OMM 0910 do not ever close their eyes.

  • Grmann1001

    Big Brother and OMM 0910 do not ever close their eyes.

  • Tuna Ghost

    One would think the proof is in the removal of these statements. Palin herself must think they’re incendiary, after all she removed them with a quickness.

    Anyway, since you wanted references:

    Beck: “Let me tell you this, if you don’t fight on the battlefield of ideas, with your mouth, with your mind… there will be another battlefield. It will be fought with guns… I know you see what is being created… I know you see that we are being led into an American cemetery.” November 11, 2009

    THis is his schtick. “You’re going to be crushed by the Progressive menace. Your home, your kids, your everything is going to be destroyed.” And then he tells them over and over to “fight back”. You want examples of that? Those are even easier to find. Just let me know.

    I mean, that took me like seven seconds on Google. Not difficult, guy. Videos of controversial language have, surprise surprise, been removed for “copyright” reasons, despite the fact that they’ve been up for a year or more.

  • MAgickrunk777

    the only thing thats tastes better than the shit coming out of my mouth is the dick I’m sucking on after I’m done trolling.

  • Anonymous
  • Kali23Yuga

    Ok,you’re right on what you note here. But my original point was not : “guns don’t kill people, people kill people”. I just think we have to be careful to not turn societal issues in a gun-issue f.e. Because we then tend to battle the symptons and not the root of the problem.
    But this may as well be an isolated case, instead of a societal issue that has its radical offshoots. We have to wait and see what the culprit’s motives were.

  • Poo on ur chin

    like you just did with nothing 2 debate

  • Andrew

    My ad hominem was both relevent, accurate, and grammatical, unlike all of yours.

  • 5by5

    [Sarcasm Alert!] Because scalding someone’s entire body in third degree burns with hot tar is so much more civilized…..

  • 5by5
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  • Poo on ur chin

    I think you maybe right i felt like killing these targets after these videos i bet you did to. Tell me you felt it too!! Oh wait only lunatics defer killing rather the political removal. So i bet you want to get rid of the first amendment too stop this? If i told you to eat shit and die is that a threat? Ever played a game and said to your opponent i am going 2 destroy you if so be-careful you maybe an extremist!!

  • MAgickrunk777

    This comment makes you right.

  • MAgickrunk777

    Ever played a game and said to your opponent i am going 2 destroy you if so be-careful you maybe an extremist!! Actually you may have it backwards you all are calling for the removal of the first amendment that is fascism.

  • Tuna Ghost

    You’ve responded very well to being proved completely wrong in everything you’ve stated thus far. No one could possibly believe you’re some sort of idiot who doesn’t know what he’s talking about and has no leg to stand on.

    No one.

  • Tuna Ghost

    You got it all wrong buddy! I’m on your side, I’m supporting you, yeah? You’ve done well! You don’t look like a complete idiot at all! No one could say you’re ignoring the obvious because you’re not very bright. Absolutely no one. I mean that.

    Sincerely.

    Absolutely no one.

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  • Effortlessmentality

    If his favorite books are two of probably the most historically controversial political books in history, and he shot a republican representative, I think a motive can be fairly easily assumed. Whether or not such an assumption would be accurate is anyone’s guess, but I think that a political ideal (or rebellion) would be a pretty obvious answer.

  • Effortlessmentality

    I would say reading those books in this country would mark one as educated. Or at least open-minded enough to give it a shot. I’m of the firm belief that reading of any material more educational than Twilight is worthwhile. Perhaps you should read them.

    “It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.” – Aristotle

  • Effortlessmentality

    “Mental disorder” is such a loose term these days that it’s practically an excuse for saying “we don’t know”. I think that it’s quite the opposite. People who make those kinds of decisions do them because they’re set on the belief that it’s the right thing to do.

    Although I will agree that genius and insanity are hard to separate at times, I think that this boy knew full-well what he was doing and the consequences of doing so. So mentally disordered? No. Not at all.

  • Effortlessmentality

    Let’s say we do outlaw guns and legalize marijuana. We’d end up in the exact same boat we are already. People would have marijuana and abuse it, and people would illegally own guns they obtain from the black market. The only thing that would change is hunting fans would be in jail instead of pot-smokers.

  • Effortlessmentality

    I agree that guns are sissy weapons, don’t get me wrong.

    But it’s a sign of the times. Knife vs. gun doesn’t win too often. Even if we did outlaw guns to the public, the kind of person who would mug you isn’t going to obtain a gun by legal means anyhow.

  • Effortlessmentality

    Not to mention that criminalized marijuana isn’t killing anyone. In fact, in most places it’s de-prioritized, meaning the cops aren’t even really looking for it. If they catch you with it, yeah, they’ll still hit you with a possession charge, but they aren’t going door-to-door to catch you.

    So they might stick you in jail for a bit and make you pay some money, they’re not executing anyone. S no, it’s not killing anybody.

  • Effortlessmentality

    I’m in a half-agreement with you here.

    The whole “guns don’t kill people” argument is almost true. I’m from Arkansas, nearly everyone here has guns in their houses, but where I live has one of the lowest violent crime rates in the country.

    However, guns do kill people because that’s what they’re designed to do. There is no purpose for a gun other than to injure. And so… yes and no. But you’re right: we shouldn’t confuse cause and effect.

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