• Alturn

    What is not God?

    “The statement of Jesus: “I am the way and the truth and the life; no one comes to the Father but by Me” means that only through awareness can we reach the Almighty. This truth is personified in Jesus in the Christian tradition. If you ‘de-personify’ this truth, it can be understood as the principle of awareness.
    Maitreya’s view is that you cannot reach the Almighty through knowledge and wisdom alone. This path can lead you to deities, essentially creations of the mind. In this there is no salvation. This is why the way to the Father is ‘only through Jesus’, or awareness, because in awareness there is no attachment, no desire. In awareness there is no time or space.”
    “Maitreya teaches that when you are detached and therefore aware, you are one with God. Your doubts disappear.”
    According to Maitreya, there should be no conscious attempt to seek God’s ‘whereabouts’, because if you are honest, sincere and detached the door opens.”
    “Divinity is pure and eternal. The Self exists in the heart which is where you experience God.”
    “Everything is within mind, spirit and body. Those who learn the art of Self-realization in mind, spirit and body will experience that everything within and without is from one source which we call God. In effect, anything and everything belongs to the Almighty. Once that sense is developed in the mental body, then the spiritual body will follow the same pattern and the Self will be able to express equilibrium and detachment. The ‘isms’ of desire such as ‘mine’ and ‘yours’ will fall into the right perspective.
    The Self is not mind, spirit or body. The Self is immortal. Mind, spirit and body are the clothes given by the Almighty at birth and discarded at death. It is Life, which is experience, which becomes the source of energy. Experience is very important for the Self to be able to move in mind, spirit and body and establish mastery. When this is done, creation is mastered.”
    - World Teacher Maitreya through an associate as reported by Share International

    • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

      How about you shorten that up with “be moral & just & focus on opening your mind to all of the Universe experiences & not worship a fairy tale & misconstrue good advice.” :D

  • Alturn

    What is not God?

    “The statement of Jesus: “I am the way and the truth and the life; no one comes to the Father but by Me” means that only through awareness can we reach the Almighty. This truth is personified in Jesus in the Christian tradition. If you ‘de-personify’ this truth, it can be understood as the principle of awareness.
    Maitreya’s view is that you cannot reach the Almighty through knowledge and wisdom alone. This path can lead you to deities, essentially creations of the mind. In this there is no salvation. This is why the way to the Father is ‘only through Jesus’, or awareness, because in awareness there is no attachment, no desire. In awareness there is no time or space.”
    “Maitreya teaches that when you are detached and therefore aware, you are one with God. Your doubts disappear.”
    According to Maitreya, there should be no conscious attempt to seek God’s ‘whereabouts’, because if you are honest, sincere and detached the door opens.”
    “Divinity is pure and eternal. The Self exists in the heart which is where you experience God.”
    “Everything is within mind, spirit and body. Those who learn the art of Self-realization in mind, spirit and body will experience that everything within and without is from one source which we call God. In effect, anything and everything belongs to the Almighty. Once that sense is developed in the mental body, then the spiritual body will follow the same pattern and the Self will be able to express equilibrium and detachment. The ‘isms’ of desire such as ‘mine’ and ‘yours’ will fall into the right perspective.
    The Self is not mind, spirit or body. The Self is immortal. Mind, spirit and body are the clothes given by the Almighty at birth and discarded at death. It is Life, which is experience, which becomes the source of energy. Experience is very important for the Self to be able to move in mind, spirit and body and establish mastery. When this is done, creation is mastered.”
    - World Teacher Maitreya through an associate as reported by Share International

  • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

    Sounds like Christian propaganda to me & a whole lot of nothing really being said. Blah blah blah. Jesus is good, but what about Krishna or Amen-Ra? Excuse me, how about they explain why there is a Jesus-like figure a.k.a. human sacrifice of a holy son in EVERY religion? That was rhetorical, I already know the answer, but millions of brainwashed masses (including Stephen Colbert’s crowd) don’t know a shit from a fart, to put it bluntly.

    • Butter Knife

      I’m so sorry that you are unable to actually hear what others say. I can only imagine what an empty, lonely existence you have.

      Suffice it to say that no, it was hardly “Christian propaganda” in any conventional sense of the word.

      • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

        Oh, please, get off that high horse & stop jumping to conclude that you know EVERYTHING about my life, be it my mental, emotional & physical happiness. For your information, I live a very full-filling life & a lot of assholes like you try & bring me down regularly for being an athiest faggot in a dress. So, go find a hobby & stop trying to assume you know me, cuz you don’t. Thanks & go fuck yourself. :D

      • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

        & furthermore, who are you to judge me & tell me how I live anyways. Only “god” can do that, last time I checked.

        & I still say Stephen Colbert is all BLAH BLAH BLAH & no longer the comedian he used to be, before he sold out. BOTH of them in this video are just talking heads, worshiping their “god,” & being disgusting double-standard republicans as well. I still fail to see any intelligence behind their conversation & I don’t see any point of it other than to waste 30 minutes MORE of time that could be replaced with reading a good book or putting something ABOVE a 2nd grade level of entertainment on television to promote INTELLIGENCE, not superstition & skepticism & cynicism..

        • Butter Knife

          I’ll agree that Stephen Colbert has become less funny, I think the act has worn thin and that, frankly, the actual right-wing psychopaths have gotten so crazy that he’s no longer really capable of lampooning them.

          By the way, you do realize he’s a satirist, and that the entire show is a parody of those right-wing talk shows, right? The stated goal is to make fun of Bill O’Reilly.

          Anyway, I don’t really care how you live your life, but it’s apparent from your comments that A) you’re not as smart as you think you are B) you’re not as transgressive as you think you are (oh no, a cross-dressing homosexual… the world must be ending because I haven’t seen one of them walking down the street since… um… yesterday) and C) you have a deep-seated need for others to approve of you, including random strangers on the internet, and when people don’t instantly congratulate you for being such a badass you lash out because they must be Christian oppressors, even when they really aren’t either of those things.

          • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

            “Assumption, my dear, is the mother of all fuck-ups.”

            Once again, you’re quick to judge, with no evidence. Just keep shoving words in my mouth & misconceptions in your head. Shows how much of a douche you really are.

            I also didn’t say I was smarter than you, nor did I even hint at it, but it shows what is going thru your head. “Omg a drag queen just put me in my place! THAT DESERVES RETALIATION & HATEFUL NONSENSE.”

            But what is the real issue? Is it because I insulted Stephen Colbert & god all in one hit? Or is it because you have nothing better to do than fight with a queer, because you think I’m an easy target? I think it’s a little of both with a dash of envy.

            Personally, I could give a shit less what you or anyone else thinks of me. & did I say that being a DRAG QUEEN makes me better than you or was transgressive? NO, you assumed that because you’re obviously INTIMIDATED by my presence & don’t understand what the fuck you’re looking at. You’re probably like most guys, tongue hanging out, drooling, then you find out I’m a man & you kill yourself shortly after. & trust me, I’m not just saying it, you’ve proved yourself to be a judgmental asshole who hangs their shit on others. & also, when most people do treat me like shit or try to bring me down, I don’t assume they are Christian oppressors. I assume their parent’s didn’t love them enough or they got beat up in school OR, most likely, they are afraid of their sexuality & therefor closet fags. No, I don’t hang any of my shit on someone else. instead, I shine the mirror right back in their face.

            Yes, looking at guys in make-up, even a touch of eyeliner, makes you gay & will make you burn in hell. LOL

            I won’t let some dick make me his bitch on a damn conspiracy site, where most of the people are objective & not CONDUCIVE to the conversation.

            & if you really didn’t care, you’d stop jumping the gun & forcing your judgments on me, & forcing your bullshit onto me. Keep your ISSUES in your fucked-up head & off my computer screen. I think that summed it all up, perfectly.

          • Butter Knife

            Anita, I’m assuming things about you based on things you’ve actually said… you’re assuming things about me based on… fuck it, i don’t even know.

            First things first, I’m not a Christian. Nor do I subscribe to any theological or philosophical system in which any sort of deity is required, let alone one in which failure to believe in or properly worship one is a moral failure of any sort. I do believe in a deity, of sorts, but my beliefs are far closer to secular humanism and deism than they are to Abrahamic theism.

            Secondly, you seem to think i have a problem with your sexuality, or with your being a drag queen. I don’t. In truth, I am an active member of several queer-friendly groups and an equal rights activist. Many of my closest personal friends identify as gay, lesbian, bisexual, asexual, transgender, transsexual, pansexual, or simply “other”. Including a few drag queens. Heck, I go drag from time to time myself, and I own the heels to prove it. Simply put, you assume that I have a problem with your being a drag queen and that the fact intimidates me. Bitch, please.

            My criticism is, was, and always will be, that your ideological blindness is no better or more enlightened than that of Christians. You made a bullshit assertion that Stephen Colbert and Sean Dorrance Kelly are perpetrating “Christian propaganda” (your words, not mine), and I called you on it. You decided that this was about me being a Christian (which I’m not) forcing my beliefs (which I don’t hold) on you because of your sexual identity (of which I was unaware).

            So yes, I stand behind everything I’ve said, but little I haven’t. If you’d like to have an honest discussion about the philosophy actually discussed in this interview, including some of the valid criticisms of it, I’d be happy to oblige, but as it stands your points are all invalid… and fairly stupid.

          • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

            So my ideological blindness is because I refuse to listen to a “celebrity” talking about worshiping god, when he himself is worshiped like a golden calf, along with the countless celebrities who are deified for their lack of talent?

            That is, as you said, “FUCKING STUPID,” just as I called this “Christian propaganda.”

            But before I continue, I want to clear something up. I am not making you out to have any problem with my sexuality. I am using it as an example as how people don’t accept others for their personal beliefs. My personal belief is that that interview is Christian propaganda. You’re personal belief is, “Anita is fucking stupid because she doesn’t agree with Stephen Colbert & the idiot next to him.” Say what you want, that is EXACTLY what this is boiled down to. Just as I’m not going to waste time reading the Bible, full of incest & war, I’m not going to waste time to call Stephen & the guy they paid to talk about NOTHING, Christian propagandist pushing their dogma on all his viewers!!!!

            I used to be Christian. It didn’t work for me & I have plenty of assurance that it’s a crock of shit mean’t to keep the sheep in a straight line to the slaughter house. Does that mean all good advice falls upon my deaf ears? HELL NO. If I was theologically blind, I wouldn’t have bothered to study Buddhism, Satanism, Wicca, Cabala & whathehell ever else is out there to “expand the mind.” Just as I replied to someone else in this thread, I believe that Christianity can give you a good direction, but if idiots like STEPHEN COLBERT & the highly-paid moron beside him talking a whole lot of NOTHING whatsoever, continue to make-up attributes for their “god” & tell us all the theology behind it, then I consider it PROPAGANDA, especially if they are being paid to rant & joke about something this tedious! Who else is absorbing their message, other than devout Christians? All I hear is “god is good, let’s add some extra words & give him attributes that we imagined ourselves.”

            I don’t approach ANY religion objectively. I develop an informed opinion first. & half the time I approach a new religion, not because I want some guidance, but because I am curious about how people develop spiritually!

            & also, this conversation was originally about how I feel Stephen is talking a load of shit, not questioning anyone’s religious values or anything near the sort! I also didn’t accuse you of being Christian either, you threw that out there, just as I threw my sexuality in your face as MY EVIDENCE towards oppression for following a different path, NOT as something to hold over you. From the start, you have been a dick & from the way it seems, you’re pissed because I don’t like Stephen Colbert!

            & since I am describing what you claim to be your personal beliefs, then why are we not seeing eye to eye? What is the problem with me holding an objective view against an idiot paid millions to talk circles & propaganda to the masses? This isn’t just because they are talking about god. The problem is that Stephen Colbert is using his influence to spew more CRAP into people’s minds! He is a tool of the republicans & he fails miserably as a politician, too. I’m sure you saw his address towards the congress about immigration. He was selling himself out & using this “character” he created, which is NOTHING like his original prowess & intellect. He is making himself look like an highly paid idiot who says what his writers want him to & NOT what he personally believes is moral.

            If I shown this video to any Atheist, they would agree that Stephen & the nut-sack next to him are talking a load of bullshit to fill some time & get them BOTH some cash in their pockets! & the fact that he is on Comedy Central is enough to be evidence of him selling his beliefs to the “Illuminati” or the PROPAGANDA MACHINE, all for the sake of making him a millionaire. He is in the same group as the liars at FOX NEWS & ANY OTHER MEDIA that lies to us daily.

            I still can’t wrap my head around why people are paid to talk about the greatness of Jesus, when we still murder each other in his name. Why would somebody take the easy road & study up on a subject a child could master, when they should study to be, I don’t know.. MARINE BIOLOGIST!? That, to me, is taking the easy route to the cash fo r as little work as possible. you can say a million different things about god & still be talking about nothing, because the god they talk of DOESN’T EXIST & only causes WAR.

            One more thing I would like to add: Ever notice the picture of Adam & god by Michelangelo? Adam is surrounded by the shape of the Earth, suggesting worldly things, but god’s presence is surrounded by the shape of a BRAIN, suggesting god is the product of the human mind. & with that, so are all the attributes given to him.

            & I have a feeling, regardless of what ANYONE says to you, be it kindly objective or aggressive, you will STILL be a dick & STILL call people stupid, even tho they have made PLENTY of valid points. I can do the same thing to you, too, but that in itself would be as stupid as your pointless objection to my OPINION.

          • Butter Knife

            You are extremely committed to being pissed off.

            I said it’s not christian Propaganda. If you’d like to argue that it is, give some explanation for it.

            The interview was about a philosophy text examining and contrasting contemporary and archaic thoughts and beliefs in an attempt to figure out what it is that “we’re missing”. Through the book, this further turns into an exploration of “the Sacred’ in modern culture, or what we truly take seriously on a psychological and emotional level. It is implied that, at least in the West, religion no longer has a clear monopoly on this.

            One of the traditions examined was that of Christianity, and while the author does state that he feels Jesus is “different” from other, earlier, gods, he does not in any way claim that makes Jesus real… just a different kind of deity. Stephen Colbert yammered around that for a bit because he has an incessant need to murder his own joke, but the core of it was at worst a general endorsement of format.

            Since you seem to think I particularly agree with the stated positions, here are some criticisms.

            The authors appear to have subscribed to massive historical revision in their characterizations of past religious beliefs: only in recent times have formal schools of thought contrary to theism been devised, but to assume that such lack in years prior is a result of piety rather than a number of other factors (apathy, asymmetric access to education and technology, selective record-keeping, or simple assumption of silent majority) is fallacious.

            Similarly, the authors seemed to assume that something actually is substantially different, philosophically, between now and the past. Much like the notion that “kids these days are out of control” this seems to be a commonly made assumption for which no supporting evidence exists and vast amounts of contradictory evidence are ignored. Philosophers and theologians have made such laments consistently for the past three millenia or so… indeed. it is their writings that we look to in order to find what we have so recently lost.

            The authors seem to have taken great interest in shared positive emotional response as a morally significant phenomenon which we should endeavor to pursue. While it may be culturally and socially valuable to have such moments, this is hardly a self-evident truth.

            Stephen Colbert conducted the interview poorly, attempting to insert superfluous jokes and wildly redirecting the discussion before allowing the guest to actually answer any questions in full… it was actually rather frustrating, almost like trying to read a book with somebody else turning the pages too quickly or watching TV while one of those obsessive channel-changers has the remote; before you can really figure out what’s going on, let alone properly assess it, the entire scenario is forcibly ripped away and replaced with something only vaguely related.

          • Bud Bundy

            U MAD?

      • 5by5

        Cut the shit, Butter Knife.

        The notion that if one is not religious (and specifically enamored of your particular conception of a God figure), that somehow it automatically means that the person’s life is devoid of happiness is idiotic and rude.

        Rather, I think that it simply means as Karen Armstrong says, that, “Religion, is like a raft. Once you get across the river, moor the raft, and go on. Don’t lug it with you if you don’t need it anymore.”

        Those who have “abandoned religion” have instead a more adult and mature approach to life. With growing up, comes a cost. With any new thing we learn, there is a price. You can learn to fly, but birds will lose their wonder. You can have freedom, but with it comes responsibility. You can put down the God security blankey, but it means facing death honestly, and not looking to a Daddy figure to save the day. It means becoming self-reliant.

        Moreover, you seem to commit a rather convenient sin of omission by forgetting that, as Pascal said, “Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction.”

        • Butter Knife

          I’m not a Christian. I’m not a conventional theist.

          I’m pointing out that, if you actually listen to the interview, calling in Christian propaganda is fucking stupid.

          Cut the shit yourself.

      • Simiantongue

        Empty lonely existence? I beg to differ, It is theists who live an empty existence. One of lonely delusion, you’ve bought the snake oil promises that there is “something better”. But for your entire life the “somethings better and bigger than us” has been staring you in the face. You didn’t have the presence of mind to see it.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6w2M50_Xdk

        • Butter Knife

          I indicated it must be an empty, lonely existence BEING UNABLE TO HEAR WHAT OTHERS SAY.

          What about that indicates I believe in any sort of god, let alone that I am criticizing atheists?

          I hold in contempt those too blinded by their own assumptions to consider the thoughts of others, regardless of what their beliefs may be.

          • Bud Bundy

            u mad bro?

          • Simiantongue

            Apparently we all think you are saying just that. Everyone responding has gotten that impression, that you believe in some sort of god, are criticizing atheists saying that they lead an empty lonely existence. Multiple people have responded to you on just that assumption of what you are saying. Lets assume you didn’t really mean to say what you evidently have said. Which is more likely, that all of us have some sort of reading comprehension problem or that you just can’t seem to articulate to others what you mean?

            “What about that indicates I believe in any sort of god”

            Besides the insufferable attitude?

            Butter Knife 02/15/2011 11:55 AM in reply to 5by5
            “I’m not a Christian. I’m not a conventional theist.”

            So you’re telling 5by5 you’re a theist and at the same time, as if nobody could read your responses to others, you’re asking me incredulously “what indicates I believe in any sort of god”.
            Let me guess you’re probably going to now claim that you are not a “real” theist, that you believe in some incomprehensible, amorphous, unknowable entity that you don’t consider a traditional rotgut “god” or some such double talk. You’re a piece of work there amigo.

          • Butter Knife

            First things first, let’s reiterate the actual post we’re talking about:

            __________________________________________________________________________________
            Butter Knife 02/15/2011 02:40 AM in reply to Anita Cigarette.
            I’m so sorry that you are unable to actually hear what others say. I can only imagine what an empty, lonely existence you have.
            __________________________________________________________________________________

            I’m going with reading comprehension failure, actually.

            I stated what I meant by a lonely, empty existence: inability to understand the thoughts of other people. It has nothing to do with atheism/theism. It never did. Perhaps I was not articulate enough, my apologies if this is the case, but I still don’t see anything about that post indicating that I have a problem with atheism (I do not) nor that I believe in a deity (which I do, though certainly not the Christian one, and others asserted this well before I confirmed it).

            If anything, I’d see a case that I’m being mean to the hearing-impaired… I actually do apologize for insinuating that their lives are empty and lonely.

            And, just to be a little more contrarian… several people (actually, 3 or 4… depending on if you count the “u mad bro?” guy) *who have responded* seem to think those things. Any number of people *who have not responded* may not think those things. Although maybe they did… it’s so hard to make objective claims of absolute truth in our chaotic, unknowable reality.
            __________________________________________________________________________________
            Simiantongue Today 01:44 AM in reply to Butter Knife
            Let me guess you’re probably going to now claim that you are not a “real” theist, that you believe in some incomprehensible, amorphous, unknowable entity that you don’t consider a traditional rotgut “god” or some such double talk. You’re a piece of work there amigo.
            __________________________________________________________________________________

            Many of those qualities may apply.

            Cute that you think only non-atheists can have insufferable attitudes, too. You’re quite a piece of work yourself.

          • P97ayoui

            I am an atheist and I never thought you were criticizing anybody for being atheist, you were pointing out how much of a douchebag Anita Cigarette was being for calling the video “Christian propaganda,” despite the fact that the video was pretty much about how to find “the sacred” in a non-religious society. All the other commenters seem like annoying assholes to me.

            Cheers.

  • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

    Sounds like Christian propaganda to me & a whole lot of nothing really being said. Blah blah blah. Jesus is good, but what about Krishna or Amen-Ra? Excuse me, how about they explain why there is a Jesus-like figure a.k.a. human sacrifice of a holy son in EVERY religion? That was rhetorical, I already know the answer, but millions of brainwashed masses (including Stephen Colbert’s crowd) don’t know a shit from a fart, to put it bluntly.

  • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

    How about you shorten that up with “be moral & just & focus on opening your mind to all of the Universe experiences & not worship a fairy tale & misconstrue good advice.” :D

  • Butter Knife

    I’m so sorry that you are unable to actually hear what others say. I can only imagine what an empty, lonely existence you have.

    Suffice it to say that no, it was hardly “Christian propaganda” in any conventional sense of the word.

  • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

    Oh, please, get off that high horse & stop jumping to conclude that you know EVERYTHING about my life, be it my mental, emotional & physical happiness. For your information, I live a very full-filling life & a lot of assholes like you try & bring me down regularly for being an athiest faggot in a dress. So, go find a hobby & stop trying to assume you know me, cuz you don’t. Thanks & go fuck yourself. :D

  • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

    & furthermore, who are you to judge me & tell me how I live anyways. Only “god” can do that, last time I checked.

    & I still say Stephen Colbert is all BLAH BLAH BLAH & no longer the comedian he used to be, before he sold out. BOTH of them in this video are just talking heads, worshiping their “god,” & being disgusting double-standard republicans as well. I still fail to see any intelligence behind their conversation & I don’t see any point of it other than to waste 30 minutes MORE of time that could be replaced with reading a good book or putting something ABOVE a 2nd grade level of entertainment.

  • dirty johnny

    Oh for Xrist’s Fucking sake. I’ve been checking up on disinfo for over a decade now, and there is one fucking thing you can never depend on here: an interesting discussion of Xrist. The world is filled with Old Timey Hellfire, Megachurch Walmartery and Catholasty. I know. You know. Chances are, if you are looking at this site, you are not a conventional “sheep within the fold.”

    But for fuck’s sake, I remember when this site actually gave a shit about occultism. If you respect magik, if you respect action at a distance, if you respect Hermetic traditions and the transformative power of representation, language and … what shall i say… them tricky go-betweens… How can you be so dismissive of the Christ story?

    Y’all are just scared of your nuns and deacons. Apostasy is a rare thing. Mostly people lie to themselves; say they don’t believe in whatever spooks them shitless. If you realize that this story and these teachings belong to you as much as any steeple or pyramid? Then you really put a foot on a path…

    Heresy. It’s all about heresy. It’s your story as much as the pope’s, or billy graham’s or jim jones’. It’s as malleable as your comprehension and as permanent stardust. Use it or they will.

    But this place here is mostly for bitching about Fox news or nuns or whatever bullshit. That whining in your voice is just proof they have all the fucking say all fucking day.

    Sorry to be a little ranty. I just wish this site was more Anarcho-Magico-Politico than a fucking Comedy Central mirror. Colbert is funny. No shit.

    • Fiver

      Amen.

    • dumbsaint

      There’s actually a tonne of Christians and atheists exposed to the site through things like social media these days. You only need to look at the comment count of any heated atheist/christian article. I agree there’s nothing more boring than actually reading any of it though.

      You could always submit articles you find/write and help steer the ship back into esoteric waters. A lot of crap used to be submitted to the old site too, it just never saw the front page.

      • dirty johnny

        Thanks for the reply. I’m actually not very techy, as you might have guessed. I have to admit, I don’t understand the mechanisms of social media at all. I actually always pictured disinfo as being more like a magazine. You know, a million possible flecks of shit thrown at the fan and a relatively small number of people organizing them into a whole turd. I know this contradicts the “wiki” and “viral” nature of information these days, but in my immediate experience “organizing info into consumable bites” the old Mad Men, or whatever it’s called, paradigm holds strong. I hold the fairly anachronistic profession of painting commercial signs by hand.

        I also gotta admit, I don’t have a wide net for trolling the internet. Nonetheless, forgive my naivete, but how do you submit? I’m not particularly hell-bent on esoteric, but how did the front-page ratio change? I’d just like to find a forum that has more to do with language and information as occultism, and knowledge as power dynamics.

        Sorry if this is a stupid post. A lot of sites get annoyed if you haven’t read the FYI or whatever. Mostly I can never find that shit. It’s like fine print on a pharmaceutical ad…

        • Andrew

          There’s a red button up near the top right of the page that reads “submit story.”

  • dirty johnny

    Oh for Xrist’s Fucking sake. I’ve been checking up on disinfo for over a decade now, and there is one fucking thing you can never depend on here: an interesting discussion of Xrist. The world is filled with Old Timey Hellfire, Megachurch Walmartery and Catholasty. I know. You know. Chances are, if you are looking at this site, you are not a conventional “sheep within the fold.”

    But for fuck’s sake, I remember when this site actually gave a shit about occultism. If you respect magik, if you respect action at a distance, if you respect Hermetic traditions and the transformative power of representation, language and … what shall i say… them tricky go-betweens… How can you be so dismissive of the Christ story?

    Y’all are just scared of your nuns and deacons. Apostasy is a rare thing. Mostly people lie to themselves; say they don’t believe in whatever spooks them shitless. If you realize that this story and these teachings belong to you as much as any steeple or pyramid? Then you really put a foot on a path…

    Heresy. It’s all about heresy. It’s your story as much as the pope’s, or billy graham’s or jim jones’. It’s as malleable as your comprehension and as permanent stardust. Use it or they will.

    But this place here is mostly for bitching about Fox news or nuns or whatever bullshit. That whining in your voice is just proof they have all the fucking say all fucking day.

    Sorry to be a little ranty. I just wish this site was more Anarcho-Magico-Politico than a fucking Comedy Central mirror. Colbert is funny. No shit.

  • Fiver

    Amen.

  • Anonymous

    There’s actually a tonne of Christians and atheists exposed to the site through things like social media these days. You only need to look at the comment count of any heated atheist/christian article. I agree there’s nothing more boring than actually reading any of it though.

    You could always submit articles you find/write and help steer the ship back into esoteric waters. A lot of crap used to be submitted to the old site too, it just never saw the front page.

  • dirty johnny

    Thanks for the reply. I’m actually not very techy, as you might have guessed. I have to admit, I don’t understand the mechanisms of social media at all. I actually always pictured disinfo as being more like a magazine. You know, a million possible flecks of shit thrown at the fan and a relatively small number of people organizing them into a whole turd. I know this contradicts the “wiki” and “viral” nature of information these days, but in my immediate experience “organizing info into consumable bites” the old Mad Men, or whatever it’s called, paradigm holds strong. I hold the fairly anachronistic profession of painting commercial signs by hand.

    I also gotta admit, I don’t have a wide net for trolling the internet. Nonetheless, forgive my naivete, but how do you submit? I’m not particularly hell-bent on esoteric, but how did the front-page ratio change? I’d just like to find a forum that has more to do with language and information as occultism, and knowledge as power dynamics.

    Sorry if this is a stupid post. A lot of sites get annoyed if you haven’t read the FYI or whatever. Mostly I can never find that shit. It’s like fine print on a pharmaceutical ad…

  • 5by5

    Cut the shit, Butter Knife.

    The notion that if one is not religious (and specifically enamored of your particular conception of a God figure), that somehow it automatically means that the person’s life is devoid of happiness is idiotic and rude.

    Rather, I think that it simply means as Karen Armstrong says, that, “Religion, is like a raft. Once you get across the river, moor the raft, and go on. Don’t lug it with you if you don’t need it anymore.”

    Those who have “abandoned religion” have instead a more adult and mature approach to life. With growing up, comes a cost. With any new thing we learn, there is a price. You can learn to fly, but birds will lose their wonder. You can have freedom, but with it comes responsibility. You can put down the God security blankey, but it means facing death honestly, and not looking to a Daddy figure to save the day. It means becoming self-reliant.

    Moreover, you seem to commit a rather convenient sin of omission by forgetting that, as Pascal said, “Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction.”

  • Andrew

    There’s a red button up near the top right of the page that reads “submit story.”

  • Manny Furious

    The Disinfo Community needs to read some Joseph Campbell. He basically despised Christianity, but even he could give a splendid exegesis of what the Christ myth represents in terms of spiritual growth and meaning in life. It’s a powerful, beautiful myth, unfortunately one that has been twisted and manipulated and interpreted as literal truth by far too many….

    • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

      I agree, I believe it has a good message, an excellent guide for humanity, but it’s also an evil tool to control people & justify murdering others who are different or worship their own way.

      • Manny Furious

        Humans will find anything to control and justify the murder of others. I don’t consider myself “religious” by any means, but I think religion is a convenient scapegoat. It takes “evil” people to make an “evil tool”. If it weren’t religion, it would be something else… anything that separates “them” from “us”.

        • David Frost

          “Humans will find anything to control and justify the murder of others.”

          Like atheism

  • Manny Furious

    The Disinfo Community needs to read some Joseph Campbell. He basically despised Christianity, but even he could give a splendid exegesis of what the Christ myth represents in terms of spiritual growth and meaning in life. It’s a powerful, beautiful myth, unfortunately one that has been twisted and manipulated and interpreted as literal truth by far too many….

  • Butter Knife

    I’m not a Christian. I’m not a conventional theist.

    I’m pointing out that, if you actually listen to the interview, calling in Christian propaganda is fucking stupid.

    Cut the shit yourself.

  • Butter Knife

    I’ll agree that Stephen Colbert has become less funny, I think the act has worn thin and that, frankly, the actual right-wing psychopaths have gotten so crazy that he’s no longer really capable of lampooning them.

    By the way, you do realize he’s a satirist, and that the entire show is a parody of those right-wing talk shows, right? The stated goal is to make fun of Bill O’Reilly.

    Anyway, I don’t really care how you live your life, but it’s apparent from your comments that A) you’re not as smart as you think you are B) you’re not as transgressive as you think you are (oh no, a cross-dressing homosexual… the world must be ending because I haven’t seen one of them walking down the street since… um… yesterday) and C) you have a deep-seated need for others to approve of you, including random strangers on the internet, and when people don’t instantly congratulate you for being such a badass you lash out because they must be Christian oppressors, even when they really aren’t either of those things.

  • Simiantongue

    Empty lonely existence? I beg to differ, It is theists who live an empty existence. One of lonely delusion, you’ve bought the snake oil promises that there is “something better”. But for your entire life the “somethings better and bigger than us” has been staring you in the face. You didn’t have the presence of mind to see it.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6w2M50_Xdk

  • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

    Once again, you’re quick to judge, with no evidence. Just keep shoving words in my mouth & misconceptions in your head. Shows how much of a douche you really are.

    I also didn’t say I was smarter than you,. nor did I even hint at it, but it shows what is going thru your head. “Omg a drag queen just put me in my place! THAT DESERVES RETALIATION & HATEFUL NONSENSE.”

    But what is the real issue? Is it because I insulted Stephen Colbert & god all in one hit? Or is it because you have nothing better to do than fight with a queer, because you think I’m an easy target? I think it’s a little of both with a dash of envy.

    Personally, I could give a shit less what you or anyone else thinks of me. & did I say that being a DRAG QUEEN makes me better than you? NO, you assumed that because you’re obviously INTIMIDATED by my presence. I won’t let some dick make me his bitch on a damn conspiracy site, where most of the people are objective & not CONDUCIVE to the conversation.

    & if you really didn’t care, you’d stop jumping the gun & forcing your judgments on me, & forcing your bullshit onto me. Keep your ISSUES in your fucked-up head & off my computer screen.

  • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

    I agree, I believe it has a good message, an excellent guide for humanity, but it’s also an evil tool to control people & justify murdering others who are different or worship their own way.

  • Manny Furious

    Humans will find anything to control and justify the murder of others. I don’t consider myself “religious” by any means, but I think religion is a convenient scapegoat. It takes “evil” people to make an “evil tool”. If it weren’t religion, it would be something else… anything that separates “them” from “us”.

  • Butter Knife

    Anita, I’m assuming things about you based on things you’ve actually said… you’re assuming things about me based on… fuck it, i don’t even know.

    First things first, I’m not a Christian. Nor do I subscribe to any theological or philosophical system in which any sort of deity is required, let alone one in which failure to believe in or properly worship one is a moral failure of any sort. I do believe in a deity, of sorts, but my beliefs are far closer to secular humanism and deism than they are to Abrahamic theism.

    Secondly, you seem to think i have a problem with your sexuality, or with your being a drag queen. I don’t. In truth, I am an active member of several queer-friendly groups and an equal rights activist. Many of my closest personal friends identify as gay, lesbian, bisexual, asexual, transgender, transsexual, pansexual, or simply “other”. Including a few drag queens. Heck, I go drag from time to time myself, and I own the heels to prove it. Simply put, you assume that I have a problem with your being a drag queen and that the fact intimidates me. Bitch, please.

    My criticism is, was, and always will be, that your ideological blindness is no better or more enlightened than that of Christians. You made a bullshit assertion that Stephen Colbert and Sean Dorrance Kelly are perpetrating “Christian propaganda” (your words, not mine), and I called you on it. You decided that this was about me being a Christian (which I’m not) forcing my beliefs (which I don’t hold) on you because of your sexual identity (of which I was unaware).

    So yes, I stand behind everything I’ve said, but little I haven’t. If you’d like to have an honest discussion about the philosophy actually discussed in this interview, including some of the valid criticisms of it, I’d be happy to oblige, but as it stands your points are all invalid… and fairly stupid.

  • Butter Knife

    I indicated it must be an empty, lonely existence BEING UNABLE TO HEAR WHAT OTHERS SAY.

    What about that indicates I believe in any sort of god, let alone that I am criticizing atheists?

    I hold in contempt those too blinded by their own assumptions to consider the thoughts of others, regardless of what their beliefs may be.

  • Bud Bundy

    U MAD?

  • Bud Bundy

    u mad bro?

  • http://twitter.com/AnitaCigarette Anita Cigarette.

    So my ideological blindness is because I refuse to listen to a “celebrity” talking about worshiping god, when he himself is worshiped like a golden calf, along with the countless celebrities who are deified for their lack of talent?

    That is, as you said, “FUCKING STUPID,” just as I called this “Christian propaganda.”

    I used to be Christian. It didn’t work for me & I have plenty of assurance that it’s a crock of shit mean’t to keep the sheep in a straight line to the slaughter house. Does that mean all good advice falls upon my deaf ears? HELL NO. If I was theologically blind, I wouldn’t have bothered to study Buddhism, Satanism, Wicca, Cabala & whathehell ever else is out there to “expand the mind.” Just as I replied to someone else in this thread, I believe that Christianity can give you a good direction, but if idiots like STEPHEN COLBERT & the highly-paid moron beside him talking a whole lot of NOTHING whatsoever, continue to make-up attributes for their “god” & tell us all the theology behind it, then I consider it PROPAGANDA, especially if they are being paid to rant & joke about something this tedious! Who else is absorbing their message, other than devout Christians? All I hear is “god is good, let’s add some extra words & give him attributes that we imagined ourselves.”

    I don’t approach ANY religion objectively. I develop an informed opinion first. & half the time I approach a new religion, not because I want som,e guidance, but because I am curious about how people develop spiritually!

    & also, this conversation was originally about how I feel Stephen is talking a load of shit, not questioning anyone’s religious values or anything near the sort! I also didn’t accuse you of being Christian either, you threw that out there, just as I threw my sexuality in your face as MY EVIDENCE towards oppression for following a different path, NOT as something to hold over you. From the start, you have been a dick & from the way it seems, you’re pissed because I don’t like Stephen Colbert!

    & since I am describing what you claim to be your personal beliefs, then why are we not seeing eye to eye? What is the problem with me holding an objective view against an idiot paid millions to talk circles & propaganda to the masses? This isn’t just because they are talking about god. The problem is that Stephen Colbert is using his influence to spew more CRAP into people’s minds! He is a tool of the republicans & he fails miserably as a politician, too. I’m sure you saw his address towards the congress about immigration. He was selling himself out & using this “character” he created, which is NOTHING like his original prowess & intellect. He is making himself look like an highly paid idiot who says what his writers want him to & NOT what he personally believes is moral.

    If I shown this video to any Atheist, they would agree that Stephen & the nut-sack next to him are talking a load of bullshit to fill some time & get them BOTH some cash in their pockets! I still can’t wrap my head around why people are paid to talk about the greatness of Jesus, when we still murder each other in his name.

    One more thing I would like to add: Ever notice the picture of Adam & god by Michelangelo? Adam is surrounded by the shape of the Earth, suggesting worldly things, but god’s presence is surrounded by the shape of a BRAIN, suggesting god is the product of the human mind. & with that, so are all the attributes given to him.

    & I have a feeling, regardless of what ANYONE says to you, be it kindly objective or aggressive, you will STILL be a dick & STILL call people stupid, even tho they have made PLENTY of valid points. I can do the same thing to you, too, but that in itself would be as stupid as your pointless objection to my OPINION.

  • David Frost

    This is a better article than disinfo’s usual posting of Dawkins and his hate group on a regular basis

  • David Frost

    This is a better article than disinfo’s usual posting of Dawkins and his hate group on a regular basis

  • David Frost

    “Humans will find anything to control and justify the murder of others.”

    Like atheism

  • Butter Knife

    You are extremely committed to being pissed off.

    I said it’s not christian Propaganda. If you’d like to argue that it is, give some explanation for it.

    The interview was about a philosophy text examining and contrasting contemporary and archaic thoughts and beliefs in an attempt to figure out what it is that “we’re missing”. Through the book, this further turns into an exploration of “the Sacred’ in modern culture, or what we truly take seriously on a psychological and emotional level. It is implied that, at least in the West, religion no longer has a clear monopoly on this.

    One of the traditions examined was that of Christianity, and while the author does state that he feels Jesus is “different” from other, earlier, gods, he does not in any way claim that makes Jesus real… just a different kind of deity. Stephen Colbert yammered around that for a bit because he has an incessant need to murder his own joke, but the core of it was at worst a general endorsement of format.

    Since you seem to think I particularly agree with the stated positions, here are some criticisms.

    The authors appear to have subscribed to massive historical revision in their characterizations of past religious beliefs: only in recent times have formal schools of thought contrary to theism been devised, but to assume that such lack in years prior is a result of piety rather than a number of other factors (apathy, asymmetric access to education and technology, selective record-keeping, or simple assumption of silent majority) is fallacious.

    Similarly, the authors seemed to assume that something actually is substantially different, philosophically, between now and the past. Much like the notion that “kids these days are out of control” this seems to be a commonly made assumption for which no supporting evidence exists and vast amounts of contradictory evidence are ignored. Philosophers and theologians have made such laments consistently for the past three millenia or so… indeed. it is their writings that we look to in order to find what we have so recently lost.

    The authors seem to have taken great interest in shared positive emotional response as a morally significant phenomenon which we should endeavor to pursue. While it may be culturally and socially valuable to have such moments, this is hardly a self-evident truth.

    Stephen Colbert conducted the interview poorly, attempting to insert superfluous jokes and wildly redirecting the discussion before allowing the guest to actually answer any questions in full… it was actually rather frustrating, almost like trying to read a book with somebody else turning the pages too quickly or watching TV while one of those obsessive channel-changers has the remote; before you can really figure out what’s going on, let alone properly assess it, the entire scenario is forcibly ripped away and replaced with something only vaguely related.

  • Simiantongue

    Apparently we all think you are saying just that. Everyone responding has gotten that impression, that you believe in some sort of god, are criticizing atheists saying that they lead an empty lonely existence. Multiple people have responded to you on just that assumption of what you are saying. Lets assume you didn’t really mean to say what you evidently have said. Which is more likely, that all of us have some sort of reading comprehension problem or that you just can’t seem to articulate to others what you mean?

    “What about that indicates I believe in any sort of god”

    Besides the insufferable attitude?

    Butter Knife 02/15/2011 11:55 AM in reply to 5by5
    “I’m not a Christian. I’m not a conventional theist.”

    So you’re telling 5by5 you’re a theist and at the same time, as if nobody could read your responses to others, you’re asking me incredulously “what indicates I believe in any sort of god”.
    Let me guess you’re probably going to now claim that you are not a “real” theist, that you believe in some incomprehensible, amorphous, unknowable entity that you don’t consider a traditional rotgut “god” or some such double talk. You’re a piece of work there amigo.

  • Butter Knife

    First things first, let’s reiterate the actual post we’re talking about:

    __________________________________________________________________________________
    Butter Knife 02/15/2011 02:40 AM in reply to Anita Cigarette.
    I’m so sorry that you are unable to actually hear what others say. I can only imagine what an empty, lonely existence you have.
    __________________________________________________________________________________

    I’m going with reading comprehension failure, actually.

    I stated what I meant by a lonely, empty existence: inability to understand the thoughts of other people. It has nothing to do with atheism/theism. It never did. Perhaps I was not articulate enough, my apologies if this is the case, but I still don’t see anything about that post indicating that I have a problem with atheism (I do not) nor that I believe in a deity (which I do, though certainly not the Christian one, and others asserted this well before I confirmed it).

    If anything, I’d see a case that I’m being mean to the hearing-impaired… I actually do apologize for insinuating that their lives are empty and lonely.

    And, just to be a little more contrarian… several people (actually, 3 or 4… depending on if you count the “u mad bro?” guy) *who have responded* seem to think those things. Any number of people *who have not responded* may not think those things. Although maybe they did… it’s so hard to make objective claims of absolute truth in our chaotic, unknowable reality.
    __________________________________________________________________________________
    Simiantongue Today 01:44 AM in reply to Butter Knife
    Let me guess you’re probably going to now claim that you are not a “real” theist, that you believe in some incomprehensible, amorphous, unknowable entity that you don’t consider a traditional rotgut “god” or some such double talk. You’re a piece of work there amigo.
    __________________________________________________________________________________

    Many of those qualities may apply.

    Cute that you think only non-atheists can have insufferable attitudes, too. You’re quite a piece of work yourself.

  • P97ayoui

    I am an atheist and I never thought you were criticizing anybody for being atheist, you were pointing out how much of a douchebag Anita Cigarette was being for calling the video “Christian propaganda,” despite the fact that the video was pretty much about how to find “the sacred” in a non-religious society. All the other commenters seem like annoying assholes to me.

    Cheers.

  • Iuwefh

    Man, you’re a douchebag Anita Cigarette. I am an atheist, and if anything the fact that you are a homosexual cross-dresser would make me much more likely to support your comments. But you have counteracted that feeling of goodwill with your relentless ignorance and vigorous douchebaggery.

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