• Anonymous

    I support the Occupy movement, but I get the impression that quite a lot of the sentiment within it is inspired by conspiracy theory.

    Am I wrong about this? Or are we really witnessing the moment when “conspiracy culture’s” influence finally spills out onto the streets?

    The guys in this video are talking about 2012 and the awakening of higher consciousness etc. All ideas that have been promoted by conspiracy culture. Maybe 2012 is meaningful, and maybe it isn’t, and maybe it will end up being a self-fulfilling prophecy with people who believe in it rising up and making it happen.

    There is a hell of a lot of nonsense to be found in “conspiracy theory world”. I just hope the people down on the frontlines of Occupy have sorted the wheat from the chaff.

  • BrianApocalypse

    I support the Occupy movement, but I get the impression that quite a lot of the sentiment within it is inspired by conspiracy theory.

    Am I wrong about this? Or are we really witnessing the moment when “conspiracy culture’s” influence finally spills out onto the streets?

    The guys in this video are talking about 2012 and the awakening of higher consciousness etc. All ideas that have been promoted by conspiracy culture. Maybe 2012 is meaningful, and maybe it isn’t, and maybe it will end up being a self-fulfilling prophecy with people who believe in it rising up and making it happen.

    There is a hell of a lot of nonsense to be found in “conspiracy theory world”. I just hope the people down on the frontlines of Occupy have sorted the wheat from the chaff.

    • Calypso_1

      Conspiracy culture within a society tends to exist inversely with the degree of openness and liberty. 

      • BrianApocalypse

        Very good point, and I would add to that:

        Conspiracy culture within a society tends to exist inversely with the degree of comprehension the population have of their world.

        In other words, the more secretive the society, and the less the people understand about how the world works,  the more likely they are to resort to ‘mythological’ explanations for it.

    • GoodDoktorBad

      “conspiracy culture” Why choose such a loaded phrase? That’s a term usually used by folks who either don’t want to believe that some conspiracies do indeed exist or they themselves have some secrets that they would prefer to keep private. 

      I think you see some real pattern of people making correlations between real events and predicted ones (ie The Apocalypse, 2012, huge man made and natural disasters, “terrorism”, bible prophesy, etc.) 

      I agree with the statement – “There is a hell of a lot of nonsense to be found in “conspiracy theory world”"
      But frankly, the world is one big conspiracy made manifest by everyone involved. 

      It’s healthy that people ask questions where questions are due. Unfortunately, people often jump to conclusions or just plain “make shit up” as it suits them. ”Conspiracy theory world” attempts to unravel mysteries…

      • BrianApocalypse

        I don’t think it’s a loaded phrase at all. In fact, I use that term to distinguish genuine and valid research and journalism from the more general morass of wild speculation that encompasses “Conspiracy culture”. I’ve never seen this term used by people in the way you describe. The only context I’ve ever seen it used is by people who are very informed about conspiracy theory and recognize that there is a cultural element to the scene as much as a ‘research’ element.

        “Conspiracy theory world” does try to unravel mysteries, or THINKS it does anyway. It’s a rabbit hole you can lose yourself down and lose all track of what’s going on in the rest of the world.

    • Clever Screenname

      He also spoke about the necessity of analyzing the purpose and effect of the Federal Reserve system.  Is this the “conspiracy” you were referring too?  It is an extremely well documented conspiracy and by the way, the word conspiracy only means 2 or more people colluding in secret to perform an illegal act.  By this definition the majority of political history is conspiratorial in nature.  

      I think it’s a very good sign that people are not blindly falling for the various props and stages of the left/right paradigm and looking beyond the curtain to how power is actually enforced (very violently I might add) on humanity and who those puppet masters actually are *cough Rothchild/Rockefellers *cough New World Order *COUGH 911 was an obvious inside job and Kennedy was definitely not killed by a patsy Oswald.   But hey if you can’t handle the facts you can just focus on the smallest segment of his conversation where he basically said, you know what there seems to be an uptick in the speed of “revelation” meaning to REVEAL.  If this qualifies him as a “conspiracy theorist” for stating the obvious (911, TSA Molestation, Chemtrails, BP Oil Spill, Fukushima, Middle East conflict etc etc etc are just a few examples that could be informing this observation)  then perhaps you should consider actually studying the various theories and see if they weigh out.  You can’t do it by sticking with mainstream media, and if you don’t already know that or understand the dynamics of media ownership determining media content perhaps you would be better off having all of your information prechewed for you at the Huffington Post or on Yahoo news.

      There are many very deep rabbit holes, many of them intersecting, sharing many rabbits, and there are many fake conspiracy designed to create guilt by association and dismissal by lumping them all under the blanket term “conspiracy theory”.   Again I suggest making the time to study the tactics of disinformation and logical fallacies.  Check out triviumeducation.org and watch some of the videos explaining how logical fallacies are used to prevent seeing reality clearly.

      I’m not trying to be rude, I just get so sick of people dismissing things they haven’t researched as “conspiracy theory”.  Understandably these are not pleasant topics to take on, but they must be understood if we are ever going to evolve out of this neofeudalistic zombie consumer dungeon.

      If you would like references to evidence that supports the reality of the topics brought up above please respond and I would be more than happy to provide them.  We needn’t be antagonistic, let’s be scientific and let the chips fall where they may.  

      Peace in the Middle East.

      • BrianApocalypse

        Clever Screenname, with respect, your response is pretty much that of an archetypal “Conspiracy Theorist.”

        Of course, you’re making the typically sweeping assumption that I am clueless about conspiracy theories, when in fact I’ve been very interested in them for 20 years. My opinions are not those of a person who knows nothing about conspiracy theories, rather that of a person who has been saturated with them and eventually come to realize how much “signal noise” there is in the scene.

         Maybe I should be more explicit… If the Occupy movement wants to be taken seriously by America and the world at large, it must refrain from promoting topics that are the mainstay of conspiracy theory. Why? Because in the minds of the general public (the people we have to convince), such ideas are utter nonsense and the fact that people in Occupy are promoting them makes them such an easy target for right-wing detractors like Fox News.

        Whether you like it or not, the truth is that seemingly “crazy” people talking about 2012 or 9/11 etc are never ever going to be taken seriously by the people that must be convinced. The enemies of freedom employ propaganda to impress their version of reality onto the public, and we have to play them at their own game.

        Yes, the reality about the Federal Reserve is not a “theory”, it is a provable fact and as such is a valid topic of discussion. Other topics that are not provable facts are fine to speculate about but should not become the focus for Occupy philosophy.

        • Clever Screenname

          I’m not assuming anything.  I’m responding to what you wrote.  I disagree with your tactics.  The idea of ignoring the looming disasters enabled by playing within a frame work as established by enemies of freedom is a losing tactic.  It’s essentially giving up the high ground in the assumption that you can out manipulate the manipulators by continuing to ignore the reality of the situations we face and their causal agents.  All while utilizing the approved language of the manipulators strictly as invoked in your own schizoid display.  So you study conspiracy theories and yet use blanket pejorative language in an attempt to achieve populist support, I just don’t buy it.  Perhaps had we stopped this shit at Kennedy we wouldn’t be in this boat, but they did well to silence anyone through ridicule and perversion of terms then, why do you think maintaining their tactic will serve anyone now?  Also strategically we are dealing with again brinkmanship edging on WW3.  Perhaps telling the truth over all and damn the consequences is a safer bet than let the miserable bastards responsible for the rampant perversions persist so as not to isolate the enternal swing vote of the profane football watching idiot masses.  I prefer education.  Signs show this truth breaks through even the most calcified pineals in time, several doses and you may have a new crop of psychonaut anarchist libertarians skilled in the relevant histories of non violent civil disobedience coupled with a deep and penetrating knowledge of the real state of affairs and the best mechanisms for a real transformation come into being.  You may say I’m a dreamer, but I’m not the only one. Oh also you didn’t listen to what I said but you continue to assume that I am simply a “archetypal” conspiracy theorist even though I have only subscribed to material I feel would hold up in a forensic investigation of the empirical facts.  Perhaps you should remove the newspeak filters preventing you from realizing the hold cognitive dissonance has on you?  Or perhaps we should see where we agree.  End The Fed check, how about that there 9/11 Truth??

  • Anonymous

    Conspiracy culture within a society tends to exist inversely with the degree of openness and liberty. 

  • Anonymous

    “conspiracy culture” Why choose such a loaded phrase? That’s a term usually used by folks who either don’t want to believe that some conspiracies do indeed exist or they themselves have some secrets that they would prefer to keep private. 

    I think you see some real pattern of people making correlations between real events and predicted ones (ie The Apocalypse, 2012, huge man made and natural disasters, “terrorism”, bible prophesy, etc.) 

    I agree with the statement – “There is a hell of a lot of nonsense to be found in “conspiracy theory world”"
    But frankly, the world is one big conspiracy made manifest by everyone involved. 

    It’s healthy that people ask questions where questions are due. Unfortunately, people often jump to conclusions or just plain “make shit up” as it suits them. ”Conspiracy theory world” attempts to unravel mysteries…

  • Clever Screenname

    He also spoke about the necessity of analyzing the purpose and effect of the Federal Reserve system.  Is this the “conspiracy” you were referring too?  It is an extremely well documented conspiracy and by the way, the word conspiracy only means 2 or more people colluding in secret to perform an illegal act.  By this definition the majority of political history is conspiratorial in nature.  

    I think it’s a very good sign that people are not blindly falling for the various props and stages of the left/right paradigm and looking beyond the curtain to how power is actually enforced (very violently I might add) on humanity and who those puppet masters actually are *cough Rothchild/Rockefellers *cough New World Order *COUGH 911 was an obvious inside job and Kennedy was definitely not killed by a patsy Oswald.   But hey if you can’t handle the facts you can just focus on the smallest segment of his conversation where he basically said, you know what there seems to be an uptick in the speed of “revelation” meaning to REVEAL.  If this qualifies him as a “conspiracy theorist” for stating the obvious (911, TSA Molestation, Chemtrails, BP Oil Spill, Fukushima, Middle East conflict etc etc etc are just a few examples that could be informing this observation)  then perhaps you should consider actually studying the various theories and see if they weigh out.  You can’t do it by sticking with mainstream media, and if you don’t already know that or understand the dynamics of media ownership determining media content perhaps you would be better off having all of your information prechewed for you at the Huffington Post or on Yahoo news.

    There are many very deep rabbit holes, many of them intersecting, sharing many rabbits, and there are many fake conspiracy designed to create guilt by association and dismissal by lumping them all under the blanket term “conspiracy theory”.   Again I suggest making the time to study the tactics of disinformation and logical fallacies.  Check out triviumeducation.org and watch some of the videos explaining how logical fallacies are used to prevent seeing reality clearly.

    I’m not trying to be rude, I just get so sick of people dismissing things they haven’t researched as “conspiracy theory”.  Understandably these are not pleasant topics to take on, but they must be understood if we are ever going to evolve out of this neofeudalistic zombie consumer dungeon.

    If you would like references to evidence that supports the reality of the topics brought up above please respond and I would be more than happy to provide them.  We needn’t be antagonistic, let’s be scientific and let the chips fall where they may.  

    Peace in the Middle East.

  • Clever Screenname

    He also spoke about the necessity of analyzing the purpose and effect of the Federal Reserve system.  Is this the “conspiracy” you were referring too?  It is an extremely well documented conspiracy and by the way, the word conspiracy only means 2 or more people colluding in secret to perform an illegal act.  By this definition the majority of political history is conspiratorial in nature.  

    I think it’s a very good sign that people are not blindly falling for the various props and stages of the left/right paradigm and looking beyond the curtain to how power is actually enforced (very violently I might add) on humanity and who those puppet masters actually are *cough Rothchild/Rockefellers *cough New World Order *COUGH 911 was an obvious inside job and Kennedy was definitely not killed by a patsy Oswald.   But hey if you can’t handle the facts you can just focus on the smallest segment of his conversation where he basically said, you know what there seems to be an uptick in the speed of “revelation” meaning to REVEAL.  If this qualifies him as a “conspiracy theorist” for stating the obvious (911, TSA Molestation, Chemtrails, BP Oil Spill, Fukushima, Middle East conflict etc etc etc are just a few examples that could be informing this observation)  then perhaps you should consider actually studying the various theories and see if they weigh out.  You can’t do it by sticking with mainstream media, and if you don’t already know that or understand the dynamics of media ownership determining media content perhaps you would be better off having all of your information prechewed for you at the Huffington Post or on Yahoo news.

    There are many very deep rabbit holes, many of them intersecting, sharing many rabbits, and there are many fake conspiracy designed to create guilt by association and dismissal by lumping them all under the blanket term “conspiracy theory”.   Again I suggest making the time to study the tactics of disinformation and logical fallacies.  Check out triviumeducation.org and watch some of the videos explaining how logical fallacies are used to prevent seeing reality clearly.

    I’m not trying to be rude, I just get so sick of people dismissing things they haven’t researched as “conspiracy theory”.  Understandably these are not pleasant topics to take on, but they must be understood if we are ever going to evolve out of this neofeudalistic zombie consumer dungeon.

    If you would like references to evidence that supports the reality of the topics brought up above please respond and I would be more than happy to provide them.  We needn’t be antagonistic, let’s be scientific and let the chips fall where they may.  

    Peace in the Middle East.

  • Anonymous

    Clever Screenname, with respect, your response is pretty much that of an archetypal “Conspiracy Theorist.”

    Of course, you’re making the typically sweeping assumption that I am clueless about conspiracy theories, when in fact I’ve been very interested in them for 20 years. My opinions are not those of a person who knows nothing about conspiracy theories, rather that of a person who has been saturated with them and eventually come to realize how much “signal noise” there is in the scene.

     Maybe I should be more explicit… If the Occupy movement wants to be taken seriously by America and the world at large, it must refrain from promoting topics that are the mainstay of conspiracy theory. Why? Because in the minds of the general public (the people we have to convince), such ideas are utter nonsense and the fact that people in Occupy are promoting them makes them such an easy target for right-wing detractors like Fox News.

    Whether you like it or not, the truth is that seemingly “crazy” people talking about 2012 or 9/11 etc are never ever going to be taken seriously by the people that must be convinced. The enemies of freedom employ propaganda to impress their version of reality onto the public, and we have to play them at their own game.

    Yes, the reality about the Federal Reserve is not a “theory”, it is a provable fact and as such is a valid topic of discussion. Other topics that are not provable facts are fine to speculate about but should not become the focus for Occupy philosophy.

  • Anonymous

    I don’t think it’s a loaded phrase at all. In fact, I use that term to distinguish genuine and valid research and journalism from the more general morass of wild speculation that encompasses “Conspiracy culture”. I’ve never seen this term used by people in the way you describe. The only context I’ve ever seen it used is by people who are very informed about conspiracy theory and recognize that there is a cultural element to the scene as much as a ‘research’ element.

    “Conspiracy theory world” does try to unravel mysteries, or THINKS it does anyway. It’s a rabbit hole you can lose yourself down and lose all track of what’s going on in the rest of the world.

  • Anonymous

    Very good point, and I would add to that:

    Conspiracy culture within a society tends to exist inversely with the degree of comprehension the population have of their world.

    In other words, the more secretive the society, and the less the people understand about how the world works,  the more likely they are to resort to ‘mythological’ explanations for it.

  • Clever Screenname

    I’m not assuming anything.  I’m responding to what you wrote.  I disagree with your tactics.  The idea of ignoring the looming disasters enabled by playing within a frame work as established by enemies of freedom is a losing tactic.  It’s essentially giving up the high ground in the assumption that you can out manipulate the manipulators by continuing to ignore the reality of the situations we face and their causal agents.  All while utilizing the approved language of the manipulators strictly as invoked in your own schizoid display.  So you study conspiracy theories and yet use blanket pejorative language in an attempt to achieve populist support, I just don’t buy it.  Perhaps had we stopped this shit at Kennedy we wouldn’t be in this boat, but they did well to silence anyone through ridicule and perversion of terms then, why do you think maintaining their tactic will serve anyone now?  Also strategically we are dealing with again brinkmanship edging on WW3.  Perhaps telling the truth over all and damn the consequences is a safer bet than let the miserable bastards responsible for the rampant perversions persist so as not to isolate the enternal swing vote of the profane football watching idiot masses.  I prefer education.  Signs show this truth breaks through even the most calcified pineals in time, several doses and you may have a new crop of psychonaut anarchist libertarians skilled in the relevant histories of non violent civil disobedience coupled with a deep and penetrating knowledge of the real state of affairs and the best mechanisms for a real transformation come into being.  You may say I’m a dreamer, but I’m not the only one. Oh also you didn’t listen to what I said but you continue to assume that I am simply a “archetypal” conspiracy theorist even though I have only subscribed to material I feel would hold up in a forensic investigation of the empirical facts.  Perhaps you should remove the newspeak filters preventing you from realizing the hold cognitive dissonance has on you?  Or perhaps we should see where we agree.  End The Fed check, how about that there 9/11 Truth??