Ron Paul’s 89 Seconds in CBS News GOP Presidential Debate

1.5 minutes out of 1 hour …  it’s a quickie, but 89 seconds is all it takes to (come) on CBS. And 89 seconds is not bad if you’re facing the military industrial complex and mainstream media. Ron Paul’s the only one making any sense in the debates (though “sense” doesn’t seem to matter when it comes to electing a candidate). Let’s give him a chance to debate President Obama … you can make it happen, all you have to do is vote for Ron Paul in the first round (Obama’s gonna win anyway). OWS, climb aboard.

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117 Responses to Ron Paul’s 89 Seconds in CBS News GOP Presidential Debate

  1. Anonymous November 18, 2011 at 5:43 am #

    I’d rather see Mr. Paul debate Bernie Sanders.

  2. Redacted November 18, 2011 at 1:43 am #

    I’d rather see Mr. Paul debate Bernie Sanders.

  3. Anonymous November 18, 2011 at 6:40 am #

    police state

  4. MoralDrift November 18, 2011 at 2:40 am #

    police state

  5. Guest November 18, 2011 at 7:07 am #

    nince thought

    http://www.tiia.co.in/

  6. Tuna Ghost November 18, 2011 at 9:25 am #

    Every time Ron Paul says something I really dig I get reminded of his loonier ideas and his casual racism, but the fact that he is being consistently ignored by the media is making me want to root for him.  

  7. Tuna Ghost November 18, 2011 at 5:25 am #

    Every time Ron Paul says something I really dig I get reminded of his loonier ideas and his casual racism, but the fact that he is being consistently ignored by the media is making me want to root for him.  

    • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 12:53 pm #

      casual racism? Some ones been  watching to much MSNBC.

      • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 1:48 pm #

        or you’ve been watching too much O’reilly.

        • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 2:19 pm #

          LOL Nope i hate Bill-o also how would you come to that conclusion?  All MSM lies get that straight it is not just FOX.

          • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 5:12 pm #

            Why specifically mention MSNBC? The only pseudo-progressive news channel in the mainstream. It strikes me as odd, because they are the only channel (well some of the time) to even engage the issue of racism. You so easily dismiss it, and it reminded me of faux pundits. Nonetheless, I NEVER watch MSM; democracy now is the only thing i “watch” these days, as well , as submedia. I “read” al jaz english as my main source of global ongoings, so i am VERY aware of the lies and spin.

          • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:01 pm #

            MSM is main stream media.  Also sorry my translations make me hard to understand at times.  What is a hick?

          • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 7:17 pm #

            Obviously well beyond your educational achievment.

          • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:21 pm #

            RETARD MSNBC is MAIN STREAM MEDIA

          • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 7:17 pm #

            And i said above, i DON’T WATCH MSNBC.

        • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 2:21 pm #

          Dose Billo say that Ron Paul in not racist?

          • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 5:08 pm #

            “in not racist”

            what does that “mean” exactly? as i don’t speak “hick”, i will need a translation.

          • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:06 pm #

            Funny even though you knew it was a typo you used it to somehow insinuate that you are right that is “ad hominem”.  That tactic only works on the school yard.  So how old are you?

          • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 7:19 pm #

            i could list several of your own school yard posts. “hypocrite.” is that a word you know?
            Yes, i am being retaliatory. Clever eh?;)

      • Tuna Ghost November 23, 2011 at 6:32 pm #

        No, I’ve been reading his newsletter and reading the things he says in interviews.  Would you like to see them?  

  8. Monkey See Monkey Do November 18, 2011 at 10:40 am #

    When he starts talking about alternatives to capitalism maybe i’ll start listening. I dont believe you need a violent revolution to overthrow capitalism either (a violent revolution will just replace the old regime with a similar one).

    The very fact he is running for president means he is comfortable working within the corrupt system. The oligarchy needs to be replaced with something more democratic where power isn’t in the hands of a few but in the hands of many. We need to stop looking at ‘leaders’ and start building co-operatives with free associations.

  9. Monkey See Monkey Do November 18, 2011 at 6:40 am #

    When he starts talking about alternatives to capitalism maybe i’ll start listening. I dont believe you need a violent revolution to overthrow capitalism either (a violent revolution will just replace the old regime with a similar one).

    The very fact he is running for president means he is comfortable working within the corrupt system. The oligarchy needs to be replaced with something more democratic where power isn’t in the hands of a few but in the hands of many. We need to stop looking at ‘leaders’ and start building co-operatives with free associations.

    • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 12:56 pm #

      Before i can take you seriously, tell me in your own words what capitalism is.

      • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 1:47 pm #

        one word:

        evil.

        • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 2:25 pm #

          So you are what, 7yrs old?  Would you find it rude if i called you a simpleton?  You don’t know what capitalism so you use AdHominem, it’s ok i understand.

          • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 5:06 pm #

            You’re the only one engaging in Ad Hominem attacks. My reply was simply a single word response to the question you had posited regarding capitalism, (i.e. describe it in your OWN words) I USED my own words. And I can go much further than that cursory definition. So NO, you do not understand nor are able to READ apparently.

          • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:13 pm #

            Evil does not describe capitalism it describes how you feel about it.  Also read a book …

            ad ho·mi·nem   [ad hom-uh-nuhm ‐nem, ahd-]
            adjective 1.appealing to one’s prejudices, emotions, or special interests rather than to one’s intellect or reason.
            2.attacking an opponent’s character rather than answering his argument.

          • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:15 pm #

            So yes i am being a jerk but i am not using it to say you are wrong.  I am doing it because you think you know everything and can’t put up.

          • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 7:17 pm #

            Well i CAN “put up,” but i am unclear as to WHAT you are asking me, specifically. How would you even KNOW if i “think i know everything?” Is there direct evidence past or present that my comments contain that specific subtext?  And furthermore, why simply come on this site, as a first time poster, to make ridiculous claims and ad hominem attacks?

          • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 7:14 pm #

            Actually I did neither of those, because an intellectual argument CAN be made for what i assert. As long as you don’t actually believe hayek or rothbard and like me have an aversion to rand.

            And i read quite a bit;) Why, do you have a book club for me to join?

          • Mr Willow November 18, 2011 at 6:34 pm #

            A few more words, then?

            A quote from Nikita Khrushchev: 

            I worked at a factory owned by Germans, at coal pits owned by Frenchmen, and at a chemical plant owned by Belgians. There I discovered something about capitalists. They are all alike, whatever the nationality. All they wanted from me was the most work for the least money that kept me alive. So I became a communist.

            Another, from David Korten:

            My claim is that we do not have a market economy, but a capitalist economy. Capitalism and the market are presented as synonymous, but they are not. Capitalism is both the enemy of the market and democracy. Capitalism is not about free competitive choices among people who are reasonable equal in their buying and selling of economic power. It is about concentrating capital, concentrating economic power in very few hands, using that power to trash everyone who gets in their way. … This is not a market, and definitely not a democracy. The basic principle of democracy is “one person one vote” and and in the capitalistic society, we have “one dollar one vote.”

            And this one, from Thomas Merton:

            It is true that the materialistic society, the so-called culture that has evolved under the tender mercies of capitalism, has produced what seems to be the ultimate limit of this worldliness. And nowhere, except perhaps in the analogous society of pagan Rome, has there ever been such a flowering of cheap and petty and disgusting lusts and vanities as in the world of capitalism, where there is no evil that is not fostered and encouraged for the sake of making money. We live in a society whose whole policy is to excite every nerve in the human body and keep it at the highest pitch of artificial tension, to strain every human desire to the limit and to create as many new desires and synthetic passions as possible, in order to cater to them with the products of our factories and printing presses and movie studios and all the rest.

            Or this, from George Orwell:

            [William] Blake was not a politician, but there is more understanding of the nature of capitalist society in a poem like “I wander through each charter’d street” than in three-quarters of Socialist literature.

            and the poem in question: 

            London

            I wander thro’ each charter’d street,
            Near where the charter’d Thames does flow,
            And mark in every face I meet
            Marks of weakness, marks of woe.

            In every cry of every Man,
            In every Infant’s cry of fear,
            In every voice, in every ban,
            The mind-forg’d manacles I hear.

            How the Chimney-sweeper’s cry
            Every black’ning Church appalls;
            And the hapless Soldier’s sigh
            Runs in blood down Palace walls.

            But most thro’ midnight streets I hear
            How the youthful Harlot’s curse
            Blasts the new born Infant’s tear,
            And blights with plagues the Marriage hearse.

            The most succinct, I think, is this one by Bertrand Russell:

            Advocates of capitalism are very apt to appeal to the sacred principles of liberty, which are embodied in one maxim: The fortunate must not be restrained in the exercise of tyranny over the unfortunate.

          • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:56 pm #

            Are those your own words? lol  First let me start of by saying crony capitalism is horrible but it is not capitalism.  The reason these huge corporations are destroying us is because we don’t have free market capitalism.  And truly it rarely has existed.  So do you honestly think if we changed to any other system with the same “rulers” thing’s would be different?  You do realize that all systems use money or a form of bartering unless we become slaves.  Also is it not true any system can be bad?

          • Mr Willow November 18, 2011 at 7:30 pm #

            What you witness is the ‘free market’, as in a market not restricted by regulation. 

            Capitalism, in my own words, is institutionalised selfishness, that replaces the desire for society to be better, for people to be better—whether you define ‘better’ as more honourable or just or whatever—or for us to want to reach a point of collaborative state of productivity with the desire to simply accrue as much wealth as possible, and to hell with absolutely everything that stands in the way of that goal. 

            If you define capitalism as a simple, private transaction between two people, then I certainly will not criticize such a thing, and I would agree that concern for the self should at least take some precedence. But capitalism as it is practised currently, as it was espoused by Ayn Rand, and followed by the multitudes of Libertarians and touted by Republicans as the absolute answer for everything is absolute insanity and will ultimately lead to ruin, for the very simple fact that it completely ignores people who were not blessed by Mammon’s golden touch, and essentially turns society into a free for all over useless bits of paper and metal stamped with dead men’s portraits. It breeds paranoia and suspicion of everyöne, not only because you are meant to figure out how to exploit your neighbour, but also because you expect your neighbour to be formulating a method to exploit you. A society cannot survive in this way, as it encourages its citizens to participate in the direct or indirect murder of one another.

            It would be much more beneficial, I think, if collaboration, and the quality of the service or product produced by the collaboration, were to replace this rampant and vehement narcissism bred by dictators of people’s desires. 

            I leave you with another quote, from Woodrow Wilson:

            In most parts of our country men work, not for themselves, not as partners in the old way in which they used to work, but generally as employees,—in a higher or lower grade,—of great corporations. There was a time when corporations played a very minor part in our business affairs, but now they play the chief part, and most men are the servants of corporations.

          • RayB November 18, 2011 at 7:13 pm #

            Then the worst case scenario is “Socialist Capitalism”.

          • Jin The Ninja November 20, 2011 at 9:08 am #

            so Finland is the worse case scenario? or am i reading too much into your comment, and you don’t have a clue what the f*ck you’re talking about?

      • Idiot101 November 18, 2011 at 3:48 pm #

        We live in a fascist police state anyways, so the argument your just waiting to throw out here is already defeated. Capitalism has failed, we need to move on to something better. 

        • Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:16 pm #

          So according to that logic every system known to man has failed.

          • Jin The Ninja November 18, 2011 at 7:11 pm #

            How so?

          • guessed November 28, 2011 at 1:12 am #

            look at the animals, government doesnt exist they just live and do what they must. we humans have this damn intelligence that makes us go to far and always believe we can fix something that shouldnt have been there in the first place. it cant work so we gotta just try to go on. Otherwise we’ve got 6billion perspectives all trying to live the best way for them and what comes out is the greediest and most demanding of those people forcing themselves in charge, thus society becomes demanding, greedy and lost.

          • Jin The Ninja November 28, 2011 at 1:45 am #

            ?

    • RayB November 18, 2011 at 1:33 pm #

      This is proof enough that you haven’t taken any time to research what he is talking about. Wait until you have the age to vote and then you can decide.

    • ChristianHypocrite November 18, 2011 at 3:09 pm #

      I agree.  It’s better to vote for Obama since he is pushing for cleaning up the corrupt system and booting out the oligarchy.  Ron Paul would just be a status quo maintainer, unlike Obama, who is providing REAL hope and change.

      • Randel November 18, 2011 at 3:51 pm #

        I think I just wet myself from laughter. If I owned a comedy award I would give it to you. 

      • guessed November 28, 2011 at 1:07 am #

        hahahhahhahahhahahahhaha

    • Biocykle November 18, 2011 at 6:39 pm #

      Better get on with it, then. Meanwhile, who would you like to run your country? (Just curious, from northern Europe, from where it really looks like Ron Paul is the only sane republican running for the election)

  10. Tinytemper November 18, 2011 at 9:15 am #

    Ron Paul doesnt share the same views as me on the creation of the universe.  Therefore I could never vote for him.  As an atheist, I’d rather vote for someone who believes in the same origin of the universe.  That’s why I voted for Obama and Bush.

    • Stir it up November 18, 2011 at 9:36 am #

      I was going to write something constructive to argue your first point, but then I saw you voted for Obummer and skull and bones member George W. Bush. So I realized your completely lost and have no idea what your talking about. Then I thought about it again and realized you are probably just trolling. No one with half a brain cell would willingly admit they voted Bush.

      FYI- NO ONE knows how the universe was “created”.    

      • ChristianHypocrite November 18, 2011 at 3:10 pm #

        > FYI- NO ONE knows how the universe was “created”.

        I DO KNOW, DAMMIT, and thats all I base my vote on!!  If atheists can do it, Christians can do it too!

        • Up&down November 18, 2011 at 4:14 pm #

          Translation: Yay, lets all be stupid! 

  11. Tinytemper November 18, 2011 at 1:15 pm #

    Ron Paul doesnt share the same views as me on the creation of the universe.  Therefore I could never vote for him.  As an atheist, I’d rather vote for someone who believes in the same origin of the universe.  That’s why I voted for Obama and Bush.

  12. Stir it up November 18, 2011 at 1:36 pm #

    I was going to write something constructive to argue your first point, but then I saw you voted for Obummer and skull and bones member George W. Bush. So I realized your completely lost and have no idea what your talking about. Then I thought about it again and realized you are probably just trolling. No one with half a brain cell would willingly admit they voted Bush.

    FYI- NO ONE knows how the universe was “created”.    

  13. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 4:53 pm #

    casual racism? Some ones been  watching to much MSNBC.

  14. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 4:56 pm #

    Before i can take you seriously, tell me in your own words what capitalism is.

  15. RayB November 18, 2011 at 5:33 pm #

    This is proof enough that you haven’t taken any time to research what he is talking about. Wait until you have the age to vote and then you can decide.

  16. guest November 18, 2011 at 5:37 pm #

    Wouldn’t they just spend all day agreeing with each other? Lol

  17. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 5:47 pm #

    one word:

    evil.

  18. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 5:48 pm #

    or you’ve been watching too much O’reilly.

  19. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:19 pm #

    LOL Nope i hate Bill-o also how would you come to that conclusion?  All MSM lies get that straight it is not just FOX.

  20. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:21 pm #

    Dose Billo say that Ron Paul in not racist?

  21. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 6:25 pm #

    So you are what, 7yrs old?  Would you find it rude if i called you a simpleton?  You don’t know what capitalism so you use AdHominem, it’s ok i understand.

  22. ChristianHypocrite November 18, 2011 at 7:09 pm #

    I agree.  It’s better to vote for Obama since he is pushing for cleaning up the corrupt system and booting out the oligarchy.  Ron Paul would just be a status quo maintainer, unlike Obama, who is providing REAL hope and change.

  23. ChristianHypocrite November 18, 2011 at 7:10 pm #

    > FYI- NO ONE knows how the universe was “created”.

    I DO KNOW, DAMMIT, and thats all I base my vote on!!  If atheists can do it, Christians can do it too!

  24. DeepCough November 18, 2011 at 3:11 pm #

    Oh, Ron Paul, why so Commie?

  25. DeepCough November 18, 2011 at 7:11 pm #

    Oh, Ron Paul, why so Commie?

  26. Idiot101 November 18, 2011 at 7:48 pm #

    We live in a fascist police state anyways, so the argument your just waiting to throw out here is already defeated. Capitalism has failed, we need to move on to something better. 

  27. Randel November 18, 2011 at 7:51 pm #

    I think I just wet myself from laughter. If I owned a comedy award I would give it to you. 

  28. Up&down November 18, 2011 at 8:14 pm #

    Translation: Yay, lets all be stupid! 

  29. Jarel November 18, 2011 at 9:03 pm #

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRiWpOUe2UA

  30. Jarel November 18, 2011 at 5:03 pm #

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRiWpOUe2UA

  31. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 9:06 pm #

    You’re the only one engaging in Ad Hominem attacks. My reply was simple a word word response to the question you had posited regarding capitalism, (i.e. describe it in your OWN words) I USED my own words. And I can go much further than that cursory definition. So NO, you do not understand nor are able to READ apparently.

  32. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 9:08 pm #

    “in not racist”

    what does that “mean” exactly? as i don’t speak “hick”, i will need a translation.

  33. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 9:12 pm #

    Why specifically mention MSNBC? The only pseudo-progressive news channel in the mainstream. It strikes me as odd, because they are the only channel (well some of the time) to even engage the issue of racism. You so easily dismiss it, and it reminded me of faux pundits. Nonetheless, I NEVER watch MSM; democracy now is the only thing i “watch” these days, as well , as submedia. I “read” al jaz english as my main source of global ongoings, so i am VERY aware of the lies and spin.

  34. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 10:01 pm #

    MSM is main stream media.  Also sorry my translations make me hard to understand at times.  What is a hick?

  35. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 10:06 pm #

    Funny even though you knew it was a typo you used it to somehow insinuate that you are right that is “ad hominem”.  That tactic only works on the school yard.  So how old are you?

  36. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 10:13 pm #

    Evil does not describe capitalism it describes how you feel about it.  Also read a book …

    ad ho·mi·nem   [ad hom-uh-nuhm ‐nem, ahd-]
    adjective 1.appealing to one’s prejudices, emotions, or special interests rather than to one’s intellect or reason.
    2.attacking an opponent’s character rather than answering his argument.

  37. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 10:15 pm #

    So yes i am being a jerk but i am not using it to say you are wrong.  I am doing it because you think you know everything and can’t put up.

  38. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 10:16 pm #

    So according to that logic every system known to man has failed.

  39. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 10:21 pm #

    RETARD MSNBC is MAIN STREAM MEDIA

  40. Mr Willow November 18, 2011 at 10:34 pm #

    A few more words, then?

    A quote from Nikita Khrushchev: 

    I worked at a factory owned by Germans, at coal pits owned by Frenchmen, and at a chemical plant owned by Belgians. There I discovered something about capitalists. They are all alike, whatever the nationality. All they wanted from me was the most work for the least money that kept me alive. So I became a communist.

    Another, from David Korten:

    My claim is that we do not have a market economy, but a capitalist economy. Capitalism and the market are presented as synonymous, but they are not. Capitalism is both the enemy of the market and democracy. Capitalism is not about free competitive choices among people who are reasonable equal in their buying and selling of economic power. It is about concentrating capital, concentrating economic power in very few hands, using that power to trash everyone who gets in their way. … This is not a market, and definitely not a democracy. The basic principle of democracy is “one person one vote” and and in the capitalistic society, we have “one dollar one vote.”

    And this one, from Thomas Merton:

    It is true that the materialistic society, the so-called culture that has evolved under the tender mercies of capitalism, has produced what seems to be the ultimate limit of this worldliness. And nowhere, except perhaps in the analogous society of pagan Rome, has there ever been such a flowering of cheap and petty and disgusting lusts and vanities as in the world of capitalism, where there is no evil that is not fostered and encouraged for the sake of making money. We live in a society whose whole policy is to excite every nerve in the human body and keep it at the highest pitch of artificial tension, to strain every human desire to the limit and to create as many new desires and synthetic passions as possible, in order to cater to them with the products of our factories and printing presses and movie studios and all the rest.

    Or this, from George Orwell:

    [William] Blake was not a politician, but there is more understanding of the nature of capitalist society in a poem like “I wander through each charter’d street” than in three-quarters of Socialist literature.

    and the poem in question: 

    London

    I wander thro’ each charter’d street,
    Near where the charter’d Thames does flow,
    And mark in every face I meet
    Marks of weakness, marks of woe.

    In every cry of every Man,
    In every Infant’s cry of fear,
    In every voice, in every ban,
    The mind-forg’d manacles I hear.

    How the Chimney-sweeper’s cry
    Every black’ning Church appalls;
    And the hapless Soldier’s sigh
    Runs in blood down Palace walls.

    But most thro’ midnight streets I hear
    How the youthful Harlot’s curse
    Blasts the new born Infant’s tear,
    And blights with plagues the Marriage hearse.

    The most succinct, I think, is this one by Bertrand Russell:

    Advocates of capitalism are very apt to appeal to the sacred principles of liberty, which are embodied in one maxim: The fortunate must not be restrained in the exercise of tyranny over the unfortunate.

  41. Biocykle November 18, 2011 at 10:39 pm #

    Better get on with it, then. Meanwhile, who would you like to run your country? (Just curious, from northern Europe, from where it really looks like Ron Paul is the only sane republican running for the election)

  42. Ali Abab November 18, 2011 at 10:56 pm #

    Are those your own words? lol  First let me start of by saying crony capitalism is horrible but it is not capitalism.  The reason these huge corporations are destroying us is because we don’t have free market capitalism.  And truly it rarely has existed.  So do you honestly think if we changed to any other system with the same “rulers” thing’s would be different?  You do realize that all systems use money or a form of bartering unless we become slaves.  Also is it not true any system can be bad?

  43. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:11 pm #

    How so?

  44. RayB November 18, 2011 at 11:13 pm #

    Then the worst case scenario is “Socialist Capitalism”.

  45. RayB November 18, 2011 at 11:13 pm #

    Then the worst case scenario is “Socialist Capitalism”.

  46. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:14 pm #

    Actually I did neither of those, because an intellectual argument CAN be made for what i assert. As long as you don’t actually believe hayek or rothbard and like me have an aversion to rand.

  47. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:14 pm #

    Actually I did neither of those, because an intellectual argument CAN be made for what i assert. As long as you don’t actually believe hayek or rothbard and like me have an aversion to rand.

  48. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:17 pm #

    Well i CAN “put up,” but i am unclear as to WHAT you are asking me, specifically. How would you even KNOW if i “think i know everything?” Is there direct evidence past or present that my comments contain that specific subtext?  And furthermore, why simply come on this site, as a first time poster, to make ridiculous claims and ad hominem attacks?

  49. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:17 pm #

    Well i CAN “put up,” but i am unclear as to WHAT you are asking me, specifically. How would you even KNOW if i “think i know everything?” Is there direct evidence past or present that my comments contain that specific subtext?  And furthermore, why simply come on this site, as a first time poster, to make ridiculous claims and ad hominem attacks?

  50. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:17 pm #

    And i said above, i DON’T WATCH MSNBC.

  51. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:17 pm #

    And i said above, i DON’T WATCH MSNBC.

  52. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:17 pm #

    Obviously well beyond your educational achievment.

  53. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:17 pm #

    Obviously well beyond your educational achievment.

  54. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:19 pm #

    i could list several of your own school yard posts. hypocrite. is that word you know?
    Yes, i am being retaliatory. Clever eh?;)

  55. Jin Onikoroshi November 18, 2011 at 11:19 pm #

    i could list several of your own school yard posts. hypocrite. is that word you know?
    Yes, i am being retaliatory. Clever eh?;)

  56. Mr Willow November 18, 2011 at 11:30 pm #

    What you witness is the ‘free market’, as in a market not restricted by regulated. 

    Capitalism, in my own words, is institutionalised selfishness, that replaces the desire for society to be better, for people to be better—whether you define ‘better’ as more honourable or just or whatever—or for us to want to reach a point of collaborative state of productivity with the desire to simply accrue as much wealth as possible, and to hell with absolutely everything that stands in the way of that goal. 

    If you define capitalism as a simple, private transaction between two people, then I certainly will not criticize such a thing, and I would agree that concern for the self should at least take some precedence. But capitalism as it is practised currently, as it was espoused by Ayn Rand, and followed by the multitudes of Libertarians and touted by Republicans as the absolute answer for everything is absolute insanity and will ultimately lead to ruin, for the very simple fact that it completely ignores people who were not blessed by Mammon’s golden touch, and essentially turns society into a free for all over useless bits of paper and metal stamped with dead men’s portraits. It breeds paranoia and suspicion of everyöne, not only because you are meant to figure out how to exploit your neighbour, but also because you expect your neighbour to be formulating a method to exploit you. A society cannot survive in this way, as it encourages its citizens to participate in the direct or indirect murder of one another.

    It would be much more beneficial, I think, if collaboration, and the quality of the service or product produced by the collaboration, were to replace this rampant and vehement narcissism bred by dictators of people’s desires. 

    I leave you with another quote, from Woodrow Wilson:

    In most parts of our country men work, not for themselves, not as partners in the old way in which they used to work, but generally as employees,—in a higher or lower grade,—of great corporations. There was a time when corporations played a very minor part in our business affairs, but now they play the chief part, and most men are the servants of corporations.

  57. Anonymous November 18, 2011 at 11:42 pm #

    A Socialist and a Libertarian agree? Actually likely on a few points, but I’d give it 10 minutes before a fist fight broke out.

  58. Haviqq November 19, 2011 at 2:11 am #

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqgJHq1HczsABC Blacked him out

  59. Haviqq November 18, 2011 at 10:11 pm #

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqgJHq1HczsABC Blacked him out

  60. VoxMagi November 19, 2011 at 2:42 am #

    Yo, Aaron…its a good vid…and Paul is an awesome blast of fresh air in the stale confines of the presidential race…

    …but seriously…OWS mashing up with a dude who pretty much thinks we already have too many federal controls and interference with big business? Not exactly a match made in heaven. It might work for the worst elements among the Teatards who happily suck Koch and think it would be a paradise on earth because Paul said so…but they’re just as blind as the diehard Obamanauts who still think “Change is coming…just you wait and see! if we give him 4 more years…he’ll really come through for us…this time!” No matter which way you turn…you get someone whose policies are very very friendly to large corporations…and hostile to everyone else. I’m betting OWS will pass on this one.

  61. VoxMagi November 18, 2011 at 10:42 pm #

    Yo, Aaron…its a good vid…and Paul is an awesome blast of fresh air in the stale confines of the presidential race…

    …but seriously…OWS mashing up with a dude who pretty much thinks we already have too many federal controls and interference with big business? Not exactly a match made in heaven. It might work for the worst elements among the Teatards who happily suck Koch and think it would be a paradise on earth because Paul said so…but they’re just as blind as the diehard Obamanauts who still think “Change is coming…just you wait and see! if we give him 4 more years…he’ll really come through for us…this time!” No matter which way you turn…you get someone whose policies are very very friendly to large corporations…and hostile to everyone else. I’m betting OWS will pass on this one.

    • sonicbphuct November 22, 2011 at 2:12 pm #

      I appreciate the fresh air as well, however … being generally suspect of authority, I ask myself what would the U.S. look like if RP was in power. Of course, he’s so outside the ‘acceptable’ republican, that I can’t even imagine it. I suspect I project a semi-antiauthoritarian image onto him, because, when I consider the difference between Bush or Obama (or Clinton, …) it seems that Paul might be the only one who would actually use the Federal Government to stop the Oakland police (and … um, “central cali coalition of the willing”) or the portland, or most recently, the Davis (campus? really? they’re outfitted like that?) police. Of course, I’m sure it wouldn’t actually happen, but … I get warm when I think about how Kennedy called on the National Guard to get a black student into a school. And, crazy as RP is, I secretly (not anymore, I guess) imagine he’s also got a bit of Kennedy crazy in him. And, of course with that projected hope, I imagine the OWS people be happy to get the cops off their back so they can go after the corps., instead of the parks.

      But, it’s just me projecting my hopes onto the “unknown”, like I (reluctantly) did for the current King.

  62. Anonymous November 19, 2011 at 7:05 am #

    Why do some people think that socialism, communism, Marxism as they have existed in this world are better than capitalism? America has not had true capitalism for years. We have had more of a socialism/capitalism with bad…super bad regulation and giveaways and entitlements keeping certain groups of people in a cycle of poverty. Marxism, communism, socialism, fascism, dictatorships, have all failed. It’s history. America began as a democratic republic with capitalism at its base. We have been a hugely productive country. Sure, we have made mistakes. But we have also solved a lot of problems and fixed a lot of mistakes. We have a lot more problems to fix. America has fed the world and continues to make big contributions to the world. We have forgiven huge debt. The world is in a heap of trouble right now. Everywhere is hurting. And it is “Crony capitalism” that has hurt us.

  63. Bippper November 19, 2011 at 3:05 am #

    Why do some people think that socialism, communism, Marxism as they have existed in this world are better than capitalism? America has not had true capitalism for years. We have had more of a socialism/capitalism with bad…super bad regulation and giveaways and entitlements keeping certain groups of people in a cycle of poverty. Marxism, communism, socialism, fascism, dictatorships, have all failed. It’s history. America began as a democratic republic with capitalism at its base. We have been a hugely productive country. Sure, we have made mistakes. But we have also solved a lot of problems and fixed a lot of mistakes. We have a lot more problems to fix. America has fed the world and continues to make big contributions to the world. We have forgiven huge debt. The world is in a heap of trouble right now. Everywhere is hurting. And it is “Crony capitalism” that has hurt us.

    • MoralDrift November 19, 2011 at 3:05 pm #

      not just crony capitalism, the spirit of capitalism in general; see above posts.

      As far as feeding the world, that is because North America has one of the largest prairies in the world, and is thus capable of feeding many millions of people. Temperate climate, fertile soil, good water supply make for ample food production; it really has little to do with the distribution system you choose to implement….although the distribution system does affect how many people are fed.

      I will add one caveat….the track record of farm collectivization is not good, that could be due to numerous factors and having private farms does not preclude having more equitable distribution of farm produce

    • Mr Willow November 19, 2011 at 4:31 pm #

      Why do some people think that socialism, communism, Marxism as they have existed in this world are better than capitalism?

      Probably because socialism, communism, and Marxism, have never existed in the manner they were intended. They were always the populist platforms of dictators and authoritarians, who used the delightful concepts of equality and spirit of sharing the world’s resources for the benefit of the human race as a whole—which is all communism attempts to espouse—to come into power, at which point they do a complete 180 and dominate the resources for their own personal use and gain. 

      Socialism is only a democratisation of the workplace, so that the employees oversee and control business, rather than the current hierarchical dictatorships of corporation owners, and even the owners of small businesses to a greater or lesser extent. 

      Communism, in some respects, cannot exist in the manner in which it was intended, without an immense shift in the way people view themselves as part of a group, and they they are dependent upon that group just as much as that group depends upon them. But then, I don’t favour communism, primarily because everything is controlled by the State, instead of its citizens. 

      To your point, regarding the founding of the country, another quote, from the Declaration of Independence: 

      That to secure these rights, [Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness] Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the consent of the governed,—That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

      The Constitution also mentions nothing about capitalism. And they [our founders] very well could not have formed any sort of opinion on socialism, communism, or Marxism, because Karl Marx hadn’t been born yet—and wouldn’t be for a few decades—and socialism hadn’t be formulated as a sound political philosophy quite yet..

  64. Anonymous November 19, 2011 at 7:05 pm #

    not just crony capitalism, the spirit of capitalism in general; see above posts.

    As far as feeding the world, that is because North America has one of the largest prairies in the world, and is thus capable of feeding many millions of people. Temperate climate, fertile soil, good water supply make for ample food production; it really has little to do with the distribution system you choose to implement….although the distribution system does affect how many people are fed.

    I will add one caveat….the track record of farm collectivization is not good, that could be due to numerous factors and having private farms does not preclude having more equitable distribution of farm produce

  65. Mr Willow November 19, 2011 at 8:31 pm #

    Why do some people think that socialism, communism, Marxism as they have existed in this world are better than capitalism?

    Probably because socialism, communism, and Marxism, have never existed in the manner they were intended. They were always the populist platforms of dictators and authoritarians, who used the delightful concepts of equality and spirit of sharing the world’s resources for the benefit of the human race as a whole—which is all communism attempts to espouse—to come into power, at which point they do a complete 180 and dominate the resources for their own personal use and gain. 

    Socialism is only a democratisation of the workplace, so that the employees oversee and control business, rather than the current hierarchical dictatorships of corporation owners, and even the owners of small businesses to a greater or lesser extent. 

    Communism, in some respects, cannot exist in the manner in which it was intended, without an immense shift in the way people view themselves as part of a group, and they they are dependent upon that group just as much as that group depends upon them. But then, I don’t favour communism, primarily because everything is controlled by the State, instead of its citizens. 

    To your point, regarding the founding of the country, another quote, from the Declaration of Independence: 

    That to secure these rights, [Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness] Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the consent of the governed,—That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

    The Constitution also mentions nothing about capitalism.

  66. Jin Onikoroshi November 20, 2011 at 1:08 pm #

    so Finland is the worse case scenario? or am i reading too much into your comment, and you don’t have a clue what the f*ck you’re talking about?

  67. Anonymous November 22, 2011 at 6:12 pm #

    I appreciate the fresh air as well, however … being generally suspect of authority, I ask myself what would the U.S. look like if RP was in power. Of course, he’s so outside the ‘acceptable’ republican, that I can’t even imagine it. I suspect I project a semi-antiauthoritarian image onto him, because, when I consider the difference between Bush or Obama (or Clinton, …) it seems that Paul might be the only one who would actually use the Federal Government to stop the Oakland police (and … um, “central cali coalition of the willing”) or the portland, or most recently, the Davis (campus? really? they’re outfitted like that?) police. Of course, I’m sure it wouldn’t actually happen, but … I get warm when I think about how Kennedy called on the National Guard to get a black student into a school. And, crazy as RP is, I secretly (not anymore, I guess) imagine he’s also got a bit of Kennedy crazy in him. And, of course with that projected hope, I imagine the OWS people be happy to get the cops off their back so they can go after the corps., instead of the parks.

    But, it’s just me projecting my hopes onto the “unknown”, like I (reluctantly) did for the current King.

  68. Tuna Ghost November 23, 2011 at 10:32 pm #

    No, I’ve been reading his newsletter and reading the things he says in interviews.  Would you like to see them?  

  69. guessed November 28, 2011 at 5:07 am #

    hahahhahhahahhahahahhaha

  70. guessed November 28, 2011 at 5:12 am #

    look at the animals, government doesnt exist they just live and do what they must. we humans have this damn intelligence that makes us go to far and always believe we can fix something that shouldnt have been there in the first place. it cant work so we gotta just try to go on. Otherwise we’ve got 6billion perspectives all trying to live the best way for them and what comes out is the greediest and most demanding of those people forcing themselves in charge, thus society becomes demanding, greedy and lost.

  71. Jin Onikoroshi November 28, 2011 at 5:45 am #

    ?

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