Is Hell For Real?

William-Adolphe Bouguereau (1825-1905) - Dante And Virgil In Hell (1850)Frank Schaeffer asks some “experts” for CNN:

Is it any coincidence that the latest war of religion that started on September 11, 2001, is being fought primarily between the United States and the Islamic world? It just so happens that no subgroups of humanity are more ingrained with the doctrine of hell than conservative Muslims and conservative Christians.

And nowhere on earth have conservative Christians been closer to controlling foreign policy than here in the United States. And nowhere on earth have conservative Muslims been more dominant than in the countries from which the 9/11 extremists originated – Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and Afghanistan.

What a pair George W. Bush and Osama bin Laden made! On the one hand, an American president who was a born-again evangelical with a special “heart” for the state of Israel and its importance to the so-called end times, and on the other hand a terrorist leader who believed that he was serving God by ridding the Arabian Peninsula of an American presence and cleansing the “defiled” land of Palestine of what he believed were “invader Jews.”

So whether you’re an atheist or not, the issue of who’s going to hell or not matters because there are a lot of folks on this planet – many of them extraordinarily well-armed – from born-again American military personnel to Muslim fanatics, who seriously believe that God smiles upon them when they send their enemies to hell…

[continues at CNN]

majestic

Majestic is gadfly emeritus.

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75 Comments on "Is Hell For Real?"

  1. “It just so happens that no subgroups of humanity are more ingrained with
    the doctrine of hell than conservative Muslims and conservative
    Christians.”

    Heh. You need to read up more on Taoism and Chinese and Japanese Buddhism. They’ve got stuff that makes the Christian Hell look like a playground.

  2. “It just so happens that no subgroups of humanity are more ingrained with
    the doctrine of hell than conservative Muslims and conservative
    Christians.”

    Heh. You need to read up more on Taoism and Chinese and Japanese Buddhism. They’ve got stuff that makes the Christian Hell look like a playground.

    • yeah, but the difference is
      they don’t take it literally or seriously
      most Asians, if they think about it at all,
      will try to avoid the hell of being reborn as a cockroach
      before they worry about Yama and hell

  3. Seriously? Your cultural and religious education is lacking and your premise is erroneous. Did you even Google “hell” before coming up with this? Did you even think about it for 5 minutes?

    How about watching “Big Trouble in Little China” – even something as cheesy as that recognizes that the Chinese are big on the idea of hell. 

  4. Seriously? Your cultural and religious education is lacking and your premise is erroneous. Did you even Google “hell” before coming up with this? Did you even think about it for 5 minutes?

    How about watching “Big Trouble in Little China” – even something as cheesy as that recognizes that the Chinese are big on the idea of hell. 

    • Ohthosemuslims | Sep 24, 2012 at 3:35 pm |

      Hipsters don’t need knowlege Lalla! Fact checking? pfffft! I was spewing yellow journalism before it was cool.

    • Matt Staggs | Sep 24, 2012 at 5:37 pm |

      I think that you may be confused regarding the author of this particular article. “Majestic” provided an excerpt from a piece written by CNN. Notice the use of quotes around “experts” in the sentence preceding the excerpt.

    • Matt Staggs | Sep 24, 2012 at 5:37 pm |

      I think that you may be confused regarding the author of this particular article. “Majestic” provided an excerpt from a piece written by CNN. Notice the use of quotes around “experts” in the sentence preceding the excerpt.

      • Yeah, when I first read this one I too was originally left with the impression that Majestic had offered up the offending passage.

        But, being surprised at such an obvious mistake, I re-read and realized that CNN was the culprit.

      • Yeah, when I first read this one I too was originally left with the impression that Majestic had offered up the offending passage.

        But, being surprised at such an obvious mistake, I re-read and realized that CNN was the culprit.

  5. Ted Heistman | Sep 23, 2012 at 5:55 pm |

    Is that illustrator going to hell for drawing naked guys? 

    • Calypso_1 | Sep 23, 2012 at 9:10 pm |

      That’s a damn fine wrastlin’ move.  Most folks don’t take into account the increased options for control that become available once you go al dente.

    • Calypso_1 | Sep 23, 2012 at 9:10 pm |

      That’s a damn fine wrastlin’ move.  Most folks don’t take into account the increased options for control that become available once you go al dente.

      • Did you mean al Dante?
        after all, it is his inferno

      • Did you mean al Dante?
        after all, it is his inferno

        • Calypso_1 | Sep 23, 2012 at 9:50 pm |

          No, but if found that more inflammatory tactics were indeed advisable the increased freedom of limb movements provided by a tenacious application of affixed dentition would most likely allow swift access to my Zippo. 

        • Calypso_1 | Sep 23, 2012 at 9:50 pm |

          No, but if found that more inflammatory tactics were indeed advisable the increased freedom of limb movements provided by a tenacious application of affixed dentition would most likely allow swift access to my Zippo. 

      • Did you mean al Dante?
        after all, it is his inferno

    • lifobryan | Sep 24, 2012 at 10:57 am |

      Mmmmmmmm. Buns of Hell.

    •  Hell is Hot!

  6. I am surprisingly comfortable with the idea of Christians and Muslims “sending each other to hell”.

    What cannot be corrected by rational exposition may eventually be remedied by Darwinian principles.

  7. I am surprisingly comfortable with the idea of Christians and Muslims “sending each other to hell”.

    What cannot be corrected by rational exposition may eventually be remedied by Darwinian principles.

  8. Yes, hell is real. Hell is right here on earth, thanks to religious zealotry. We have to look over our shoulders and watch news report after news report about the mass murder of innocents in the name of some asshole’s religion. We have to endure the inevitability of creeping religious-dogma-based fascism on our own doorstep thanks to the Christian right here in America, while sending our children overseas to die at the hands of Islamic fanatics. I say to hell with Christianity, Islam, and Judaism. These aspiring despots won’t stop until they subjugate all of humanity, even if it means killing us and themselves in the process. We have to do all that we can to stop them – and force them to keep THEIR religion where it belongs: in THEIR homes and in THEIR churches.

    • all wars is really based on economics ….. you can say I am fighting for my god, but we all know it comes down to land, resources or money.  So the bottom line is we will always have wars. Don’t blame religion or God. Blame man’s greed and to color the truth 

    • all wars is really based on economics ….. you can say I am fighting for my god, but we all know it comes down to land, resources or money.  So the bottom line is we will always have wars. Don’t blame religion or God. Blame man’s greed and to color the truth 

      • Why yes its always about the money, power and control! Religion is but a mere distraction….

      • Why yes its always about the money, power and control! Religion is but a mere distraction….

      • money is the only real god

      • money is the only real god

      • The real reason we are in the wars are economic 4sure. But when 50% of Americans believe that our earth is 10,000 years, I have to assume Americans wouldn’t put up with the wars unless the religious factor wasn’t present.   

      • The real reason we are in the wars are economic 4sure. But when 50% of Americans believe that our earth is 10,000 years, I have to assume Americans wouldn’t put up with the wars unless the religious factor wasn’t present.   

    • Anti-Crowley | Sep 30, 2012 at 11:42 pm |

      yes we must do all we can jimbo, we must silence their views to give rise to our own.  Gov’t is driven by greed…I mean Christianity.  I see the gov’t doing exactly what the Bible tells them to do, no wait I mean the opposite of what the Bible tells them to do…I mean…lets just kill all of those murderous Christians, kids and all.

    • Anti-Crowley | Sep 30, 2012 at 11:42 pm |

      yes we must do all we can jimbo, we must silence their views to give rise to our own.  Gov’t is driven by greed…I mean Christianity.  I see the gov’t doing exactly what the Bible tells them to do, no wait I mean the opposite of what the Bible tells them to do…I mean…lets just kill all of those murderous Christians, kids and all.

  9. Matt Staggs | Sep 23, 2012 at 6:52 pm |

    The Great Prophet Pat Benatar offers a hymn on this very topic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxYsi5Y-xOQ

  10. kowalityjesus | Sep 23, 2012 at 6:56 pm |

    This passage spoke to me more than any other:
    Keep in mind that Jesus’ words come in the context of the rest of Scripture, which says that God “desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.”  Furthermore, he “is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.”  God is far more loving, kind and patient with his enemies that we are with our enemies.  
    As for proof that GWB and the rest of his political crop are unabashed, lying Satanists, think about the fact that the GOP changed its logo in 2000 (quietly and seemingly arbitrarily) to an elephant with inverted stars from normal stars.   Also google “hillary clinton inverted stars on flag.”  These are subtle things, but the only logical explanation is that Satan controls federal politics, no doubt.

    • Nirvanasteve | Sep 23, 2012 at 7:03 pm |

      I was going to laugh at this smugly, as you do, but when I googled it I saw that the stars on the elephant were indeed inverted. What’s up with that? Even Satan wouldn’t want to pal around with those dweebs. 

    • lifobryan | Sep 23, 2012 at 10:24 pm |

      Upside-down stars.

      In Christianity, the five-point star (one point upward) refers to the wounds of Christ, and figures prominently in Arthurian/Grail symbolism. 

      In neo-pagan or wiccan tradition, the (one point upward) pentagram often refers to the four elementals & a unifying spirit.

      In both Crowley’s Thelema and traditional wiccan practice, the inverted pentagram (two points upward) refers to matter over spirit … or spirit funneled into matter .. or, in the case of the Golden Dawn, a triumph of matter over spirit. 

      In Satanism, an inverted pentagram encasing the head of a goat is a sigil of Baphomet – or sometimes Leviathan, the chaotic deity defeated by YHWH prior to Creation. (Or according to Chick Tracts, the one invoked by Freemasons).

      In the case of Republicanism, hmmmm …..?

      Well, with a north-over-south vertical visual bias, one could certainly see the Pentagon as an inverted pentagram.

      Or more likely … and I’m going to go out on a limb here …. I suspect Dick Cheney’s astrological birth chart might resemble an inverted pentagram. Or if not, I would almost bet he has an inverted pentagram tattooed on his scrotum.

      Hillary Clinton? 

      I suspect a scrotal tattoo there too …..

  11. Simiantongue | Sep 23, 2012 at 9:57 pm |

    ” The stark reality is this: either Jesus suffered for your sins to rescue you from hell, or you will suffer for your sins in hell. These are the only two options and you have an eternal decision to make.”

    Another option is that he could be completely wrong about what he believes happens after death. I’m of a mind lately that we just lose consciousness when the body can’t sustain it any more, the body ceases to function and our body degrades into it’s constituent components back into the wash of the universe. Is that so bad?

  12. Simiantongue | Sep 23, 2012 at 9:57 pm |

    ” The stark reality is this: either Jesus suffered for your sins to rescue you from hell, or you will suffer for your sins in hell. These are the only two options and you have an eternal decision to make.”

    Another option is that he could be completely wrong about what he believes happens after death. I’m of a mind lately that we just lose consciousness when the body can’t sustain it any more, the body ceases to function and our body degrades into it’s constituent components back into the wash of the universe. Is that so bad?

  13. Which way I fly is hell; myself am hell;And in the lowest deep a lower deep,Still threat’ning to devour me, opens wide,To which the hell I suffer seems a heaven.

  14. if it is for real, everyone in the world is going. Maybe this is hell

  15. David Cosgrove | Sep 24, 2012 at 5:54 pm |

    Hell is where the slaves are bred. Do the math or do the mass. Democracies or demonic races? You might call this civilization but those that have ears will always hear servile ization. If you make a show of believing dogma then you are also proving that you are not smart enough to be a threat. From farm to farmily the process goes on.and polite society is no more than a self policing state. But then we will undoubtedly get what we ask for. So what are you gonna do? I suggest dying laughing. Those who laugh last…

  16. David Cosgrove | Sep 24, 2012 at 5:54 pm |

    Hell is where the slaves are bred. Do the math or do the mass. Democracies or demonic races? You might call this civilization but those that have ears will always hear servile ization. If you make a show of believing dogma then you are also proving that you are not smart enough to be a threat. From farm to farmily the process goes on.and polite society is no more than a self policing state. But then we will undoubtedly get what we ask for. So what are you gonna do? I suggest dying laughing. Those who laugh last…

  17. ‘Hell’ as an invention of the church.
    John Shelby Spong
    http://youtu.be/SF6I5VSZVqc

  18. ‘Hell’ as an invention of the church.
    John Shelby Spong
    http://youtu.be/SF6I5VSZVqc

  19. rus Archer | Sep 25, 2012 at 6:29 pm |

    went to his own funeral in hell on an over the top shroom trip one lovely afternoon – good times – cslewis probably nailed it in the last battle, though (which seems to line up with the whole trip in the tibetan book of living and dying “you are tripping, stop believing the trip, stop coming back to the trip”) – heaven/hell = perception – if you want it to suck when/reever you find yourself (before after or during this “life”), it will

  20. rus Archer | Sep 25, 2012 at 6:29 pm |

    went to his own funeral in hell on an over the top shroom trip one lovely afternoon – good times – cslewis probably nailed it in the last battle, though (which seems to line up with the whole trip in the tibetan book of living and dying “you are tripping, stop believing the trip, stop coming back to the trip”) – heaven/hell = perception – if you want it to suck when/reever you find yourself (before after or during this “life”), it will

    • lifobryan | Sep 30, 2012 at 7:40 pm |

      I think CSLewis had a great description of hell in The Screwtape Letters:

      “clean, carpeted, warm, well-lighted offices … quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice … something like the bureaucracy of a police state, or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern.”

      Central Casting, please send in Mitt Romney ….

    • lifobryan | Sep 30, 2012 at 7:40 pm |

      I think CSLewis had a great description of hell in The Screwtape Letters:

      “clean, carpeted, warm, well-lighted offices … quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voice … something like the bureaucracy of a police state, or the offices of a thoroughly nasty business concern.”

      Central Casting, please send in Mitt Romney ….

  21. Thumbs up | Sep 26, 2012 at 1:34 pm |

    I just clicked this for the photo.

  22. Meh. Most people who post n the internet concerning such topics don’t have a good understanding of metaphysics, or, more specifically, the metaphysics behind Catholicism, whence the doctrine of hell originated. In most western philosophy prior to Descartes, good and being are convertible. In Medieval Christian philosophy, good, being, and God are also interchangeable, because God is pure being. Those who are in hell are those who hate God, and all which means the same thing (i.e. being itself, the good, the true, the beautiful, the actual–as opposed to the potential–and so on). Thus, God removes his presence (though not entirely) as a mercy. Is it still horrible to be in hell? Yes. But it is horrible to hate being itself.

    Acting as though this view of the world is self-evidently false, from some pretension that we are somehow now in a privileged vantage point over the past, is not only naive and stupid–it is indicative of intellectual immaturity. Unfortunately, the internet paves the way for drive-by assertion. If you want to learn how to think critically, and if you want to actually attack real positions that intelligent people have held, not their caricatures, read philosophy, not polemics. Aquinas or Augustine would be a good start on this particular topic.

  23. Meh. Most people who post n the internet concerning such topics don’t have a good understanding of metaphysics, or, more specifically, the metaphysics behind Catholicism, whence the doctrine of hell originated. In most western philosophy prior to Descartes, good and being are convertible. In Medieval Christian philosophy, good, being, and God are also interchangeable, because God is pure being. Those who are in hell are those who hate God, and all which means the same thing (i.e. being itself, the good, the true, the beautiful, the actual–as opposed to the potential–and so on). Thus, God removes his presence (though not entirely) as a mercy. Is it still horrible to be in hell? Yes. But it is horrible to hate being itself.

    Acting as though this view of the world is self-evidently false, from some pretension that we are somehow now in a privileged vantage point over the past, is not only naive and stupid–it is indicative of intellectual immaturity. Unfortunately, the internet paves the way for drive-by assertion. If you want to learn how to think critically, and if you want to actually attack real positions that intelligent people have held, not their caricatures, read philosophy, not polemics. Aquinas or Augustine would be a good start on this particular topic.

  24. Quique Lomeli | Oct 4, 2012 at 10:24 am |

    it is very sad to see real people loosing their way without even notice, Hell is a fantasy, it’s imposible, there is no way for it to be, I will try to explain myself:

    a. There is only one God (whichever its name may be)
    b. That God Is, and nothing could exist beyond. Otherwise He would not be Almigthy, but just a part of something bigger and more powerful that would contain His Being and something else.
    c. Hell must be someplace in this Universe, that means someplace inside God, but Hell is “the absence of God” so it could not exist inside the very thing that would annihilate it’s existence, it would need to be located “outside” The Lord, for that would need the existence of an Universe that is bigger that God Himself, which is an oxymoron.

    God gave us the ability to think, it is a Divine Order to use this ability, it is our mission to understad His creation using our brain, refusing to do so is going against The Divine Plan, refusing to think by ourselves is pretend that we know better than God Almighty, so lets think Hell out of the cuestion and center ouselves in real and possible matters as knolewdge and love and understanding.

  25. FirebrandCentral | Oct 4, 2012 at 1:52 pm |

    If there is a Hell, 90% of the U.S. Government has an express ticket. http://www.firebrandcentral.com

  26. Sean D. Daily | Oct 11, 2012 at 8:35 pm |

    Damn, that devil’s ripping that guy’s throat out with his teeth AND kneeing him in the kidney. They don’t mess around in hell.

  27. Sean D. Daily | Oct 11, 2012 at 8:35 pm |

    Damn, that devil’s ripping that guy’s throat out with his teeth AND kneeing him in the kidney. They don’t mess around in hell.

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