Satanist Lucien Greaves On Conversations With Matt Dwyer

PINK-MASS-570Comedian, writer, and actor Matt Dwyer interviews the Temple of Satan’s Lucien Greaves, the man behind the “Pink Mass” ritual performed over the grave of the mother of Westboro Baptist Church founder Fred Phelps Jr.

In a brilliant way of going at the Westboro Baptist Church using their own tactics, the ritual is performer to turn straight people gay in the afterlife. Greaves currently faces charges for desecrating a grave even though during the ritual the grave site was unharmed and left as it was found upon leaving. In this compelling talk, Graves addresses common misconceptions of Satanism and the media’s failure to accurately report not only the details surrounding the “Pink Mass,” but Greaves’ intentions by performing the ritual.

Click here to download the MP3.

, , , ,

  • Daniel Gill

    This was an embarrassment for the Satanist community. the Church of Satan also distanced themselves from this group, since they’re not related to the Church of Satan, and condemned them. That you are calling them Satanists makes me sick. They’re not Satanists. They can’t even be creative enough to come up with their own word for themselves? That’s like calling Mormons Christians.

    • Reasor

      Protip: The organization run by Peter Gilmore does not own the copyright to the character of Satan.

      • Daniel Gill

        Regardless,
        This is an embarrassment. I respect the Dead. I am a spirit medium and I would never do this. The Dead are to be venerated not disrespected while they rest.

        Nobody thinks you’re cool.

        • hagbard23

          I dunno, I think it’s pretty damn amusing.

          • Daniel Gill

            The Nether-World has a noetic quality , the Spirits bring enlightenment and through transubstantiation bring immortality. Any true occultist would never behave and do what those people did. The Nether-World is the source of our power -literally.

          • hagbard23

            Have you ever considered that not everybody holds the same picture of reality you do?

          • Daniel Gill

            Everyone does hold the same picture of reality that I do because it is true. You ever read a book before? The cosmology that I outlined is part of the fabric of the nature of the English language. Shamanism and mediumship is a human universal all around the world. It is part of the nature of humanity. And it is the same everywhere.

          • Andrew

            Are you saying Christians, Muslims, Marxists, the Temple of Satan, and Atheist Alliance International all agree with you?

        • Jiro M. Trismegistus

          I think everyone is taking this a little too seriously. I mean come, pink mass, its hilarious. If someone wanted to make my mom gay in the afterlife by ritual I’d laugh my arse off. Sounds like they didn’t disturb her head stone or any grounds so whats the big deal? I could perform a ritual with the intention of converting an entire cemetary to discordianism if i wanted. Maybe I will tomorrow after i finally complete operation mindfuck.

          • Daniel Gill

            How would you feel if some asshole desecrated a graveyard where you live, and called themselves Christian, and said it had to do with their faith? And then everyone starts pointing the finger at your church?

            They’re not Satanists. And the media should know better than to call them that.

          • hagbard23

            I probably wouldn’t care very much, being fucking dead. If I’m stuck in a hole with my meat, I’d probably be pretty glad something came along to jazz up the place. Who the fuck are you to say what they are or are not? Satanism is hardly a single, monolithic edifice. They identify themselves and their set of beliefs and practices as Satanic, then they’re Satanists.

            You seem to have fallen faaar into your personal reality tunnel. If you’re so durn enlightened, why don’t you know how to laugh?

          • Daniel Gill

            Satanism is a LaVey personality cult. Yes it is absolutely monolithic. There are only three organizations running connected to what LaVey wrote. the Temple of the Vampire, which bases itself off of writings by people like Dr. Wilhelm Reich cited in the Satanic Witch, and the writings of Marcel Mauss and “On The Choice Of A Human Sacrifice” in the Satanic Bible, itself the Maussian principle of reciprocity. There is that. There is the First Church of Satan ran by Karla LaVey . Blanche Barton was with the Church of Satan and loved LaVey until his death.

            These people who desecrated this graveyard had nothing whatsoever to do with any of these people. Not even the Temple of Set.

          • hagbard23

            So… none of the completely unrelated theistic Satanists are not Satanists? What about somebody that digs LaVey but doesn’t want to pay those dips for a fancy little card? The CoS and related groups don’t own Satan any more than NASA owns the moon because they planted a flag on it.

          • Daniel Gill

            these people belong to something called the Temple of Satan
            they’re a marginal group. they’re not connected to what LaVey wrote. they ride his coat tails only. and therefor are not Satanists. LaVey beat them to that word. They have no right to it.

          • hagbard23

            So you actually believe Luciferians don’t get to call themselves Satanists because they aren’t LaVeyan?

          • Daniel Gill

            See, that’s another word they could use.
            Creativity strikes.
            Typically, those who identify with Paradise Lost’s Satan call themselves Luciferianists. Like the fantastic french band Elend

          • process

            Hey asshole! How simple-minded do you have to be to think anybody holds a monopoly on the name “Satan” or “Satanism”? Does one really have to buy into it for $200 to join the clowns in the Church of Satan (who do nothing but work to convince fools like you that they own Satan)? But then, you think you talk to dead people, and that the buried woman herself weeps in her grave over these antics.

          • Juan

            There is no end to operation mindfuck.

      • Jiro M. Trismegistus

        Please don’t tell me someone owns the copyright to the character of satan for real. That would be even funnier than this hilarity. So does someone have to pay to use satan as a character in a comic book or a movie?…… I’m calling Shenanigans on this one : )

      • Björn Walwōn Wiberg

        Are they even active?

    • Björn Walwōn Wiberg

      What are you talking about? Im sure the CoS condemns you too, seeing as they are atheists nowadays and laughs at mediums (ref to your post below). I recall when CoS warned people about orgs that claim that *they* are the only *real* satanists. Oh, the irony. F*** you and Hail Satan!

      • Matt Staggs

        I read all of Anton LaVey’s stuff when I was a teenager. He had a name for people like that: “Occultniks”. He thought they were idiots.

        • Daniel Gill

          The both of you,
          go to the Church Of Satan homepage
          click on Source
          Scroll to the bottom of Bat Conservation International
          there is a banner to the Temple of the Vampire
          go to their webpage. Buy Bloodlines Volume 1
          in the back of Bloodlines Volume 1 is Ozark Magic and Folklore, a work on spiritism, among others, as well as Yogananda’s Autobiography of a Yogi.

          They’re a shamanism, qi gong, reiki, influenced theosophical society, run by Satanists, official

          and within the Satanic Bible written by LaVey,
          Open it. Skip to On The Choice Of A Human Sacrifice

          “The worthy magician would sacrifice their own bioelectrical energy”

          Open the Satanic Witch
          Skip to the bibliography.
          Two references to Dr. Wilhelm Reich
          who theorized orgone energy
          this is what LaVey is talking about

          Study Korean shamanism,
          the initiation is the Self-Loss
          A sacrifice of ki to the numinous

          Study Marcel Mauss’ The Gift

          In his classic work The Gift, Mauss argued that gifts are never “free”. Rather, human history is full of examples that gifts give rise to reciprocal exchange. The famous question that drove his inquiry into the anthropology of the gift was: “What power resides in the object given that causes its recipient to pay it back?” (1990:3). The answer is simple: the gift is a “total prestation”, imbued with “spiritual mechanisms”, engaging the honour of both giver and receiver (the term “total prestation” or “total social fact” (fait social total) was coined by his student Maurice Leenhardt after Durkheim’s social fact). Such transactions transcend the divisions between the spiritual and the material in a way that according to Mauss is almost “magical”. The giver does not merely give an object but also part of himself, for the object is indissolubly tied to the giver: “the objects are never completely separated from the men who exchange them” (1990:31). Because of this bond between giver and gift, the act of giving creates a social bond with an obligation to reciprocate on part of the recipient. To not reciprocate means to lose honour and status, but the spiritual implications can be even worse: in Polynesia, failure to reciprocate means to lose mana, one’s spiritual source of authority and wealth. Mauss distinguished between three obligations: giving – the necessary initial step for the creation and maintenance of social relationships; receiving, for to refuse to receive is to reject the social bond; and reciprocating in order to demonstrate one’s own liberality, honour and wealth.

          • Matt Staggs

            Please come here often. You’re becoming one of my favorite commenters.

          • Daniel Gill

            I hope my grumpy comments are interesting to some people. I don’t make shit up and I am not talking crackpot ideas. Spirit Communion, the occult, not desecrating graveyards, standard shit. Don’t reinvent the wheel. Feel hallowed dread and commune. Listen to supernatural stories , feel them, actualize them.

          • Matt Staggs

            Don’t be grumpy if you can help it, do come often and bring more interesting ideas with you.

        • Daniel Gill

          “If I’m going to get any magical power, if I am going to get anything going my way, I better get on the side of those guys, [when calling up spirits or daemons], instead of [standing in a circle] and protecting myself from them!” – Anton LaVey

          On camera interview for ‘Death Scenes’
          which you can watch on youtube
          and when he speaks those words he says them right into the camera, with beady eyes

      • Daniel Gill

        Anton LaVey – Interview from “Death Scenes”
        http://youtu.be/d8NTdqgFbDk

        LaVey speaking of spirit worship ON CAMERA.

        • Björn Walwōn Wiberg

          No, he does not. Where in that video does he do that?

    • Björn Walwōn Wiberg

      Did you even listen to the interview?

    • Jiro M. Trismegistus

      These have to be the worst disinfonaut comments ever…..or the best

      • Matt Staggs

        I’m going with the latter, although the guy saying that he was offended by a dick video and was going to tell on us to MENSA was a fave, too.

    • Matt Staggs

      I’d better watch out, then. I suppose if anyone has access to legions of lawyers it would be Satan.

      • Daniel Gill

        I didn’t say that anyone had legal entitlement to the word Satanism. Don’t put words into my mouth that I didn’t say.

        I said that these people were not Satanists. They claim to be, but the media shouldn’t be calling them that.

        I could call myself a Christian , and believe all sorts of weird shit. Doesn’t make me a Christian

    • Bruteloop

      Satanists get embarrassed?

    • Letsgetreal

      I agree totally – ‘process’/Doug Mesner/ Lucian Greaves – you are confused. People can ‘do’ whatever they wish – yes. But, to have a group called Satanic Temple – then, turn around and say that you are ‘not’ a Satanist is hypocritical. To think that you are judge and jury for what others believe or think is even more hypocritical. Who do you think you are?

      And, we have not even tapped on your obsession/job – whatever. You spend 24/7 on the internet writing articles and posting comments where you actually state vehemently that there is no such thing as Satanism. And, your passion with protecting child abusers – beating up abuse survivors – and, spreading propaganda of the False Memory Syndrome Foundation – most speculate that you are helping those who profit from child-trafficking – etc. I don’t know if that is true or not – I just wonder if those writing here know how actually deceptive and manipulative you are.

      You have brought together a diverse demography with your latest escapade – gays, Satanists, Mormons, Atheists, Christians – and, already you had the attention of child-abuse survivors, therapists, (who have had their own dealings with you). What you seem to be demonstrating is that ‘you’ have no social decency – and, that you proclaiming yourself ‘leader’ – that these other folks actually agree with your propaganda concerning child abuse and protecting pedophiles.

      These people are obviously unaware of all that you do on the internet. I fear that many may believe that, because you are a gay, Satanist who performed a ritual, that other gays and Satanists will be lumped in with you – who defends child abusers – or better yet, that they are child abusers.

      You are sick.

      I will make this clear – child abusers/perpetrators/child traffickers come in every shape and form. You anger me so badly that I can’t see straight. I am an abuse survivor, know my abusers and am not prejudice toward any group. People have freedom in this country to do as they please – except that you do not have the freedom to take away these rights – or the rights of children to be safe.

      More discussion concerning Doug’s actions on the internet – besides this graveyard escapade here – http://davidshurter.com/?p=3438#comment-17443

      Please remove link if it is not okay to leave.

      I am sorry if this post isn’t very clear – Daniel – I admire you – keep up the good work.

      • Daniel Gill

        Thank you.
        I actually know very little about who these people are. The Church of Satan are a quiet group generally to their detriment. People will remember what this fringe group has done but few people will know the truth about what the Church of Satan actually think and believe. I remember watching music videos in the 1990s, the lot of them owing their hides to Kenneth Anger movies.. anyway.. the positive influence in the world of art of the Church of Satan is plainly visible to anyone. That will always be the greatest tragedy is the lack of steam or wind in the sails of the Church of Satan that didn’t carry them into the 2000s . Now they’re background noise to groups like this one.

  • Jiro M. Trismegistus

    Is this that serious, I mean come on this is laughable so laugh it off. Go read some R.A.W. and lighten up a bit. It will do you some real good. Pink Mass really?? I just think this is hilarious. And who cares about owning the name church of satan. owning words is bullshit in general if you ask me. Rainbow Mass would have been a better name anyway. Is there really a copyright on Satan as a character? That HAS to be Bullshit. I mean everytime satan appears in a movie or a cartoon or comic book somebody has to be paid? I think not. I can’t believe I just commented on that actually. Oh well. Fnord.

  • Jiro M. Trismegistus

    Is this that serious, I mean come on this is laughable so laugh it off. Go read some R.A.W. and lighten up a bit. It will do you some real good. Pink Mass really?? I just think this is hilarious. And who cares about owning the name church of satan. owning words is crap in general if you ask me. Rainbow Mass would have been a better name anyway. Is there really a copyright on Satan as a character? That HAS to be Crapola. I mean everytime satan appears in a movie or a cartoon or comic book somebody has to be paid? I think not. I can’t believe I just commented on that actually. Oh well. Fnord.

  • Guest

    oh and i think you’re hilarious and suspect that you (lucien greaves) did not perform said ritual in hopes of being deemed cool by “disinfonaut” commentors.

  • Hocketeer

    People who label themselves as this vs. people who label themselves as that.

    • Jiro M. Trismegistus

      Wha? huh?

      • Hocketeer

        Like you wisely suggested “Read some R.A.W.”

  • Rhoid Rager

    Holy shit. I guess Peter Gilmore’s crew like the downvote button on disinfo.

    • Matt Staggs

      They’re hilarious. Reminds me of the Southern Baptists I grew up with.

      • Daniel Gill

        I’m not downvoting anyone. I’m not a dick. And I am not part of anyone’s crew.

        • gustave courbet

          So, you seem like the guy to ask; what is your succinct definition of Satanism and why do people practice it? This is not my area of study, and I always thought it only slightly more bizarre than Christianity as a belief system.

          • Daniel Gill

            There are two ways of being a Satanist,
            and only two:

            #1 – You read Paradise Lost and you identify with the character of Satan and you credit Satan for embodying what saved and brought humanity. You’re a Christian. but Satan seems pretty damn important for humanity to you. You sympathize with the Fall.

            #2 – You have read LaVey’s Satanic Bible and you agree with LaVey’s philosophy. Everyone else is riding on this guy’s coat tails or Milton’s.

          • Calypso_1

            Completely asinine.

          • gustave courbet

            From a psychological perspective I can identify with Satan as the promethian rebel defying the dictates of the master, but I find the idea of Satan as an actual entity to be about as compelling as the idea of Santa Claus. If one were to believe in the reality of the Christian God and Satan, wouldn’t throwing your lot in with the devil be like betting on the Washington Generals instead of the Harlem Globetrotters?

          • Daniel Gill

            well, LaVey never espoused the literal belief in Satan

          • gustave courbet

            Forgive my Wikipedia-based sleuthing here, but do you find a book that rejects the golden rule as a basic tenant of social conduct and espouses social darwinism(“Death to the weakling, wealth to the strong!”) to be a spiritually, morally, psychologically, or socially helpful? While I see this sorts of philosophy being practiced, it’s not by people I generally agree with(hedge-fund managers, generals, psychopaths).

          • Daniel Gill

            The golden rule rejects the natural inclination of balanced reciprocity. Look up 25 concepts of anthropology “Reciprocity” for a good video on that.

            if you smack me across the face, negative feedback should be reciprocated.

          • gustave courbet

            Firstly, thanks for getting back to me. Secondly, the golden rule does not “reject the natural inclination of balanced reciprocity” but is a prescription for avoiding the need for reciprocity, by highlighting the shared interests of both parties. The failure to adhere to it is what instigates the perceived need for reciprocity(which is handled in numerous ways from the code of Hammurabi to the ideas of Jesus and the Buddha) . I’d add that the quote “Death to the weakling, wealth to the strong!” rejects the golden rule entirely, by encouraging preemptive aggression. By the logic espoused by the first book in the Satanic Bible and Redbeard’s “Might Is Right” which it plagiarizes, if I feel the desire to do so, I ought to smack you across the face, and then continue to do so to prevent you from reciprocating, and then take your stuff, as this is the ‘right’ thing to do. In a brief search, I found Redbeard to be popular reading on neo nazi sites. And as I said previously, I see people that espouse this philosophy, but they are the ‘bad actors’ that generally profit from fucking people over. Do you espouse Redbeard’s maxim?

          • Daniel Gill

            the Satanic Bible is a work of satire.
            that is the genius of it. that’s how it conveys the truth

            Secondly,
            LaVey didn’t write those lines, if they are Redbeard’s work, leave that to Redbeard.

        • http://caffeine.shugendo.org David “Lefty” Schlesinger

          Having read a good number of your comments here, I believe I can state with some assurance that you’re mistaken, you are indeed a dick.

  • Monkey See Monkey Do

    Copying the tactics of Westboro baptist church is anything but brilliant.

  • Daniel Gill

    On youtube,
    LaVey’s on camera interview for Death Scenes
    He speaks on spirit worship. On camera. And it is clear.

    So fuck what Gilmore thinks. He knows shit.

    And anyone who calls themselves an occultist, but isn’t a practicing medium.
    Who the fuck do you think you are? You want to re-invent the wheel or invent fire?
    Everyone else calls to spirits for their power, and for transubstantiation. Why don’t you?

    Disrespecting the dead is the worst thing you could do in your whole life.

    • hagbard23

      You tout the authority of the CoS when you mention that they have distanced themselves from this group, and now you say they don’t matter because it isn’t ole Anton himself. Right.

      Chill brah. Chill.

      • Daniel Gill

        I’m saying that Gilmore when he released the COS statement condemned spirit worship. And he was really wrong to do this because he is misrepresenting what LaVey believed.

        and I said that nobody who worships spirits in their right mind would desecrate a graveyard.

        There is no contradiction in what I said.

        • process

          Nobody in their right mind does worship spirits, fool.

    • Andrew

      Why is disrespecting the dead worse than disrespecting the living?

      • frank

        because the living can punch you in the mouth.

21